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The Warlocks Den - WoW Warlock Discussions » Discussion Forums » The Library » Instance / Raiding Guides » The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats.

Instance / Raiding Guides If your DPS sucks, look in here. If you don't know what spells to cast, look in here. If you're happy as a raider, and you really wanna be better, if you're in an instance or raid, look in here.

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January 24, 2008, 02:40 AM
Neith Character Info Neith 70 Undead Warlock Thaurissan Oceania PvP Guild: Clique Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/21/40	The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats. Hey guys, i'll attempt to collate the vast amount of information in this thread in the shortest / easiest to read form. Firstly i'd like to note the fact that blizzard did not release most of the formulaes for anything in the game. As such, ALL the information, statistics and formulaes are based on empirical evidence and collated by the community around the world. As such, we've gotta keep in mind that, untill Columbus find the Americas, we might be thinking that the world is... Click here to read the entire guide Last edited by Rutiene; June 08, 2009 at 05:54 PM..

The Following 50 Users Say Thank You to Neith For This Useful Post:

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January 29, 2008, 11:01 AM	#22 (permalink)
SavageBT Character Info SavageBT 80 Undead Warlock Khaz'Goroth Oceania PvE Guild: Khazuals Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 53/0/18	Re: The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats. Love this guide. Thank you for taking the time to collate it so well. Going to book mark to link whenever asked one of the inevitable lock questions. Was especially interested to read about the switchover point between haste and spelldamage, always wondered about that. Small point of contention - casting an instant directly after a spell with a cast time might feel faster, but it is not in any way more efficient. As stated it's commonly accepted that Corr fits right after UA because they have the same duration, but you do not actually cut down your cast time. Aside from that I think someone would need some VERY convincing arguments backed up by solid maths to dispute anything here. I sincerely hope we do not see the usually predictable "you forgot Conflagrate, its better because its instant". Anyway, thank you again, awesome post.

January 30, 2008, 04:52 AM	#23 (permalink)
Kordansk Character Info Kordansk 70 Orc Warlock Skullcrusher US PvP Guild: Beatdown Brigade Talent Spec: 0/21/40	Re: The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats. BTW, there is no spell rotation for Destruction, whoever said that in here. It's basically sbolt until end of mana, lifetap to full mana and repeat, with a CoD thrown in there, or whatever debuff curse you are on. EDIT: Also, I know Leulier makes a great spreadsheet, however going strictly off a spreadsheet really doesn't help when you are looking at less than a 10% increase or decrease in DPS. Think of it this way. Try and get the same group makeup for a few weeks straight on some bosses, and observe your WWS parses. Chances are your DPS if it spreadsheets at 1050 can be anywhere between 900-1200 depending on a number of things, mainly critting more than you should, less than you should, a string of stupid resists (I had 5 in a row with 204 hit on Naj tonight, it happens), having a higher ISB uptime than normal, all of these things affect your DPS that the spreadsheet will never be able to account for. I know Leulier has an ISB calc on it, but like I said you should look at your real numbers instead of what a spreadsheet is telling you. Don't be quick to rule out anything unless you have tried it yourself on a boss. The perfect example is Immo as a destro built. The spreadsheet will tell you to cast it, not to cast it, whatever. Chances are unless you try it both ways for your current level of gear you may not know what it really might be. I stand by never casting it, ever since I have been destro because I personally feel that keeping ISB uptime is infinitely more important than a personal increase of 50 DPS or whatever the number is, and a spreadsheet will never be able to tell you that. That is all personal experiences. Spreadsheets are great at few things, but don't sit there and only do what it says, take the initiative to learn what works best for you and you alone, and that is where looking at your WWS parses really comes in handy. BTW, this is a great post Neith, and it should allow for some decent discussion. However, I feel you should add a caveat that raiding as affliction through T5 content in T5 gear is perfectly feasible, and you should be able to maintain the same DPS with less pet management. Last edited by Kordansk; January 30, 2008 at 05:11 AM..

February 02, 2008, 11:51 AM	#24 (permalink)
shirushi Character Info Shirushi 70 Blood Elf Warlock Suramar US RP Guild: Vilified	Re: The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats. As a full affliction lock for raiding, I want to add points to Malediction. I am wondering if I am already spell hit capped (202) do I need any points in suppression? I want to say no but I want to make sure. I can use these points in other areas.

February 02, 2008, 12:59 PM	#25 (permalink)
Morganfaey Character Info Panaceia 80 Blood Elf Priest Cho'gall US PvP Guild: Inebriated Raiding Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 14/57/0	Re: The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats. If you're at 202 spell hit then you can drop the points in supression and use them for something more helpful

February 03, 2008, 01:50 PM	#26 (permalink)
Dukenuke001	Re: The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats. I'm just now getting into 25 mans and TK. We just got VR down easily, I went destro. I was curious how Demo is better with the AOE damage in VR and other mobs. Raid gear help... - The Warlocks Den Forums My post with all my gear and current specs i use. Help? :D Last edited by Dukenuke001; February 03, 2008 at 04:58 PM..

February 04, 2008, 01:08 AM

#27 (permalink)

Neith

Character Info
Neith
70 Undead Warlock
Thaurissan Oceania PvP
Guild: Clique
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Talent Spec: 0/21/40

Re: The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kordansk

BTW, there is no spell rotation for Destruction, whoever said that in here. It's basically sbolt until end of mana, lifetap to full mana and repeat, with a CoD thrown in there, or whatever debuff curse you are on.

EDIT: Also, I know Leulier makes a great spreadsheet, however going strictly off a spreadsheet really doesn't help when you are looking at less than a 10% increase or decrease in DPS. Think of it this way. Try and get the same group makeup for a few weeks straight on some bosses, and observe your WWS parses. Chances are your DPS if it spreadsheets at 1050 can be anywhere between 900-1200 depending on a number of things, mainly critting more than you should, less than you should, a string of stupid resists (I had 5 in a row with 204 hit on Naj tonight, it happens), having a higher ISB uptime than normal, all of these things affect your DPS that the spreadsheet will never be able to account for. I know Leulier has an ISB calc on it, but like I said you should look at your real numbers instead of what a spreadsheet is telling you. Don't be quick to rule out anything unless you have tried it yourself on a boss. The perfect example is Immo as a destro built. The spreadsheet will tell you to cast it, not to cast it, whatever. Chances are unless you try it both ways for your current level of gear you may not know what it really might be. I stand by never casting it, ever since I have been destro because I personally feel that keeping ISB uptime is infinitely more important than a personal increase of 50 DPS or whatever the number is, and a spreadsheet will never be able to tell you that. That is all personal experiences. Spreadsheets are great at few things, but don't sit there and only do what it says, take the initiative to learn what works best for you and you alone, and that is where looking at your WWS parses really comes in handy.

BTW, this is a great post Neith, and it should allow for some decent discussion. However, I feel you should add a caveat that raiding as affliction through T5 content in T5 gear is perfectly feasible, and you should be able to maintain the same DPS with less pet management.

Completely agree with you. I've been running WWS for a few months, for every single boss fight we did. I know what you mean.

However, there is a method behind any madness. This is what i am outlining here. The reasons why people do or do not certain things that are very oftenly questioned.

As much as raid setup might vary and your dps might vary, the spreadsheet provides the average estimate in the long run. If you take 2 of your raid WWS and look at them you result might be far off the estimated by the spreadsheet. Try taking 100 of your raid WWS on the same boss, average them out and you will have a number very very close to what the spreadsheet will show.

February 04, 2008, 01:09 AM	#28 (permalink)
Neith Character Info Neith 70 Undead Warlock Thaurissan Oceania PvP Guild: Clique Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/21/40	Re: The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats. Guys, the guide is HERE for editiing purposes for now, it will be moved back here in the future.

February 05, 2008, 07:05 PM	#29 (permalink)
Wraithscythe Character Info Wraithscythe 70 Human Warlock Azgalor US PvP Guild: Social Butterflies Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 41/1/19	Re: The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats. Wondering how much crit is needed for a T5/T6 warlock that's Affliction. I've heard 20% but is that with or without talents? I have 18.99% crit in just gear but with talents I have 23.99% crit chance. Wondering if I should drop some crit and gear up on more +damage.

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January 29, 2008, 01:32 AM	#21 (permalink)
Neith Character Info Neith 70 Undead Warlock Thaurissan Oceania PvP Guild: Clique Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/21/40	Re: The guide to raiding spell rotation and raiding stats. Yep, the guide is in http://www.wowmb.net/forums/showthread.php?p=164001 for the time being so that i can edit it. I'll be putting up updates in there, in the meantime please do give me more feedback on what else you'd like to see included in there. My idea is not to make it too long and too detailed, simply because if you want really details info you could go ahead and read hundreds of pages on EJ's compendium. My goal with this guide is to give a relatively short breakdown of info on spell rotations and which stats to go for - aiming at the massive amount of people that ask that question in these forums every day and yet don't want to read a 100 page long guide.