Deathstrider's Infernal Analysis:

[SeeEs]

Deathstrider's Infernal Analysis:

Deathstrider

Level 58 Undead Warlock

Guild: Silvermana
Server: Beta Server
1. I used OUR Infernal: My analysis. | 11/11/2004 8:40:58 PM GMTST


There are now two Warlocks (at least) with Infernal: Bunnyking was kind enough to let me play with his when he summoned it. Granted I only got it for a few minutes, but here's what I have to say:

Melee Attack: The Infernal has a melee primary attack, which hit me for 190-220 damage, for an average of 210 damage a shot. with occasional hits (non-critical) for 330 or so. He crits for around 440.

He strikes every two seconds. His base average damage, therefore, is about 225, and he has a base DPS of 113. Keep in mind, that's with a 30% attack speed penalty.

If you bothered to dump in 5 points into "Improved Enslave Demon" you could lower his swing speed to about 1.8s, or about 125 DPS. Whee.

AoE Attack: He has an AoE attack of Immolate, which hits for 30 damage per second, every second. I don't know if it can be resisted, but I never managed to resist it.

This brings his total DPS up to about 143, and a fair chunk of it is AoE. He can also Daze, and possibly stun as well--not sure on this, as I didn't *live* very long when he got loose.

Infernal Starts Enslaved: Contrary to what some have thought, the Infernal STARTS enslaved to you. This is as per the standard "Enslave Demon" spell.

Why Warlocks CAN'T use Infernals in Their Present State: Not won't--can't.

When the Infernal breaks "Enslave Demon" it immediately aggros the Enslaver. If two Warlocks are present, in aggros the one who enslaved it last. It aggros the Enslaver *VERY* strongly--I've never seen any other PC or Pet pull aggro off them. Bunnyking says he has, but that its almost impossible to do.

[ul]Infernal Is:

Unreliable.

Capable of Killing the Warlock who summoned him very quickly.

Resists attempts to draw his anger elsewhere.

Controllable only by a spell with diminishing returns.

Turns his AoE Immolate on PARTY members when he goes hostile to the Warlock.

Would wreak havoc in an instance, PvP encounter, or raid.

IS TOO UNPREDICTABLE TO RISK.

Blizzard, you have built a game that discourages risk taking. Instances must be done at once, take hours to complete, and now we cannot bring in replacement party members. Durability costs are huge. Into this environment you introduce a Pet that's fully capable of breaking free at any moment and killing the summoner regardless of what the group does.

The Infernal looks cool. Its neat to have him stomping along behind me. But once he broke free, I died in seconds. Can you imagine summoning this thing in the middle of an instance or pitched battle?

I sure as heck can't. Its a death wish.

Please remember something, Blizzard, when you tweak this spell.

You are asking us to trade a reliable Pet A net POSITIVE to the group for a Pet which not only can vanish as an ally (inherently lowering the group's power) but actually turns into an ENEMY. Given how carefully most groups have to manage resources, attacks, and balances, we suddenly go from a net positive to a sizeable NEGATIVE.

This is not a case of "Permanent Positive" vs "Unreliable Bigger Positive." This is "Positive vs. Big Net Negative." And you know what? When an Infernal going asshat on me in the middle of a fight means the entire group wiping, I'm not using one.

[boscolio]

yikes, the more i read the less i want to bother. :?

[Undercrypt]

What happens to the infernal after it breaks control and eats the warlock? Does it unsummon? Stick around? Wander off?

Not that it's likely I'll need to know soon, but still. Just curious.

[Eliesputa]

This post was tossed around a lot during beta.

The bottom line is something I have pointed out before.

The Infernal is summoned enslaved.

That means you summon the infernal to fight THIS FIGHT NOW.

Warlocks that are envisioning the Infernal hanging around and playing cards have the wrong idea about Infernals as does Death.

It seems they want you to summon it right at or seconds before the start of a fight and use the Infernal to tank (and really die) a boss type encounter.

This is *the* use for them currently and likely the entire intent of the design. In beta I never heard of the Infernal being used in that manner and part of the problem is where you *can* summon one vs where you would want to summon one.

[Silvarion]

You know, Eliesputa, I don't think the raised consternation is so much from those who regret losing a gin buddy in the Infernal as implemented. I hesitate to speak for Death, who speaks for himself quite nicely, but he is not here. But that characterization just diminishes the disappointment with the Infernal implementation.

You say the Infernal's use is to fight THIS FIGHT NOW. As I read it, the chief demur is that the demon is highly unreliable for that stated purpose. If the warlock, who has worked his way up through 50 levels mind you, had to labor simply to enslave the demon, not quite being sure of actually "snaring" one even on the offer of a soul shard, then that would be one thing. Or if he dropped the demon in the midst of a pitched battle and found it poofing out 5 seconds later, well you know how fickle these higher demons can be. But to say that the Infernal's purpose is to fight THIS FIGHT NOW when "this fight now" could very likely be against the summoning warlock and his party, and to diminish the reasonable concern that this is not at all what most warlocks would consider a smart risk with an allusion to people simply wanting someone to drink tea and play house with is a very simplified presentation of the concerns expressed.

Silvarion :!:

[Eliesputa]

Do you know how long Infernals tend to stay enslaved when they are first summoned?

I'll leave it at that.

[Silvarion]

Is this a trick question? The max is five minutes with periodic and intermittent chances of breaking throughout, at which time the Infernal becomes a distinct liability.

That was actually a better place to leave it.


Silvarion :bulb:

[Deathstrider]

Anecdotal evidence suggests that the spell checks every 5 seconds and the Infernal no longer arrives enslaved. Originally we had a 15 sec "window", now we do not.

If the spell checks every 5 seconds for 5 minutes, that means it checks 60 times. Watch this:

If the Warlock has a 99% chance to KEEP the Demon Enslaved at check:

Chance Demon Remains Enslaved at:
5s: 99%
100s: 80.9%
200s: 66.2%
300s: 54.1%

If the Warlock has a 95% chance to KEEP Demon Enslaved at check::

5s: 95%
100s: 35.8%
200s: 12.8%
300s: 4.6%


Hmmmm. Quite a difference, yes?

[boscolio]

precisely why i hope Enslave Demon will be reworked to affect the chance to break instead of the penalty from being enslaved.

[Eliesputa]

Originally Posted by Deathstrider

Anecdotal evidence suggests that the spell checks every 5 seconds and the Infernal no longer arrives enslaved. Originally we had a 15 sec "window", now we do not.

If the spell checks every 5 seconds for 5 minutes, that means it checks 60 times.

Anecdotal evidence?