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Old July 21, 2009, 02:52 PM   #11 (permalink)

Character Info
Cursalock
80 Undead Warlock
Azshara US PvP
Guild: Delirium

Re: Casual gamers...

You know, I sympathize with casuals, I really do. It's just a game and people get bored doing the same things over and over, and they hear about the cool stuff other people get to do and see and they want to be part of that too. I also wouldn't have an issue with de-tuned 5 man versions of some of the raids as long as they dropped appropriately devalued gear.

However, it is also possible that if a person only has 4-6 hours a week to play a game, then raiding in World of Warcraft might not be for you. I mean really, you've got to make a couple hundred gold a week just to FINANCE your raiding (repairs, food, flasks). I've kicked people from raids for not having money to repair, or being too cheap to use flasks and food buffs.

A lot of the changes Blizzard has made and are making right now exist only to cater to casual players, and I'm really OK with that (in fact I think the extended lockouts are a great idea), but I think they can take it too far. There should be rewards for putting the time in to perfect your gear and your class, otherwise there is no point in putting the time and effort into playing. WoW probably couldn't survive without the massive casual base, but the heart and soul of Azeroth is the consistent raiders and ranked PvPers who push and pull everyone else along for the ride. I'd hate to see the day when you can start any toon at max level and have a full set of epics ala DK, run heroics for badges for two days and have gear that is equivalent to someone who's been raiding every night for a month and spent months levelling their toon and gearing them. Blizz isn't there yet, even with the Emblem of Conquest changes, but I'd hate for them to take it any further.
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Old July 21, 2009, 03:35 PM   #12 (permalink)

Character Info
cinderseer
80 Human Warlock
Azuremyst US PvE
Guild: ONE PIECE

Re: Casual gamers...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mavric240 View Post
Why not make it where you could "rent a group". You could goto a NPC and rent another NPC like a healer or tank to fill a certain role.

On the Hodir Fight you have npc's helping you out... and the field medic is worthless, and the mages never break open the other npc's that you want first (druids). So being able to rent a player/team of npcs would be more of a hastle than anything - unless you could tell them exactly what to do and when to do it, but at that point you might as well be multiboxing.

The whole concept behind WoW, or any mmorpg, is dynamic social interaction between a group of people set out to organize and complete tasks together, and although each member is unique and capable of some level of independence, they are still vulnerable and dependent on others during certain scenarios (aka - elites, boss encounters needing certain group makeups, etc). If you want to be able to solo everything, I suggest playing Oblivion... I try to see things from the casual-gamer's eyes, but just realize that there are some things that as a casual gamer you want that completely undermines not only what many peopel have accomplished, but what the whole game genre stands for.

And for the record, I know "casual raiding" guilds on my server that spend more time raiding than my guild, however my guild is the furthest in progression. So "Hardcore" is relative.
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Old July 21, 2009, 04:58 PM   #13 (permalink)

Character Info
RomaGoth
80 Human Warlock
Durotan US PvE
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Talent Spec: 30/41/0
Re: Casual gamers...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursalock View Post
You know, I sympathize with casuals, I really do. It's just a game and people get bored doing the same things over and over, and they hear about the cool stuff other people get to do and see and they want to be part of that too. I also wouldn't have an issue with de-tuned 5 man versions of some of the raids as long as they dropped appropriately devalued gear.

However, it is also possible that if a person only has 4-6 hours a week to play a game, then raiding in World of Warcraft might not be for you. I mean really, you've got to make a couple hundred gold a week just to FINANCE your raiding (repairs, food, flasks). I've kicked people from raids for not having money to repair, or being too cheap to use flasks and food buffs.

A lot of the changes Blizzard has made and are making right now exist only to cater to casual players, and I'm really OK with that (in fact I think the extended lockouts are a great idea), but I think they can take it too far. There should be rewards for putting the time in to perfect your gear and your class, otherwise there is no point in putting the time and effort into playing. WoW probably couldn't survive without the massive casual base, but the heart and soul of Azeroth is the consistent raiders and ranked PvPers who push and pull everyone else along for the ride. I'd hate to see the day when you can start any toon at max level and have a full set of epics ala DK, run heroics for badges for two days and have gear that is equivalent to someone who's been raiding every night for a month and spent months levelling their toon and gearing them. Blizz isn't there yet, even with the Emblem of Conquest changes, but I'd hate for them to take it any further.
The person with only 4-6 hours per week, by your argument, does not have the right to see endgame content then? I actually really like your posting and agree with it, but your statement regarding this just makes no sense to me. What people need to understand is that most of us "casuals" don't really care about the gear, we care more about seeing the content that the "hardcores" get to see. In fact, I would wear level 1 starting gear if I could just get the chance to see some of the endgame stuff, like Black Temple/Sunwell Plateau/Ulduar/etc..

With that being said, the gear is just the end to the means, by which I mean that if you don't have it, you won't last long in endgame in the first place. This is why so many of us would like to see some sort of alternate route to obtain gear comparable so we too can see the endgame.
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Old July 22, 2009, 01:05 AM   #14 (permalink)

Character Info
Cursalock
80 Undead Warlock
Azshara US PvP
Guild: Delirium

Re: Casual gamers...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RomaGoth View Post
The person with only 4-6 hours per week, by your argument, does not have the right to see endgame content then?
No, I didn't mean to say that so bluntly, if that's how you interpreted it. I just mean that MMORPGs aren't for everyone on every schedule. There are plenty of things I'd love to do with my time that I just don't have the time for in life.

Though on that topic, do the people who play WoW have the "right" to see all the content? I don't know.... do you have the right to be able to view all cinematics in a Final Fantasy game without completing it? Or do you have the right to be able to unlock all of the unlockable content in Gran Turismo at the touch of a button instead of spending the hours it takes to open them? If Blizzard designed the game to require a certain amount of skill and time investment, who's to tell them otherwise? Why not just start at level 80 with a full set of 226 level epics and point you towards Ulduar if it's your "right" to see end content.

The only right a player has is the ability to be able to play the content of the game as advertised. Anyone has the ability to gear up and raid.
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