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September 30, 2009, 11:18 AM	#1 (permalink)
sylandra Character Info Syline 80 Human Warlock Silvermoon Euro PvE Guild: The Delicious Danes Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/13/58	Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not! I have a question about simcraft. I thought this was the best forum for it. The optimal_raid setting is what I currently use to find scaling values but I don't think its best for me. Thing is that I am very early in gearing up and need to run 5 man dungeons, and when I get to the point I can raid I probably can't expect an "optimal raid" composition (my guild is very casual, and we pick whoever wants to join). So, how do I go about specifying available buffs in my case? Do I just specify my own buffs (Fel armor), and how do I go about doing that without the optimal_raid setting? If I want to add some common buffs like Arcane Intellect or Fortitude how do I add them?

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September 30, 2009, 02:21 PM	#2 (permalink)
Trem Character Info Tremloc 80 Human Warlock Stormrage US PvE Guild: Iliad Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/13/58	Re: Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not! you have to create a simcraft file with your specifications in it. You can read up in the simcraft docs how to do this. Alternatively, you could just set optimal_raid = 0. so, if you're using pc simcraft interations = 10000 optimal_raid = 0 wowhead = 123456789 output = sylandra_ubergear.txt

October 01, 2009, 06:26 AM

#3 (permalink)

Jenren22

Character Info
Jenerena
80 Blood Elf Warlock
Executus Euro PvP
Guild: Deliverance
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Talent Spec: 0/13/58

Re: Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trem

you have to create a simcraft file with your specifications in it. You can read up in the simcraft docs how to do this.

Which simcraft docs are we talking about here? I have looked and can't find any indication of how you would do this.

October 01, 2009, 10:50 AM

#4 (permalink)

dyson

Status: Subscriber

Character Info
Dyson
80 Human Warlock
Scilla US PvP
Guild: Eden
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Talent Spec: 0/13/58

Re: Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenren22

Which simcraft docs are we talking about here? I have looked and can't find any indication of how you would do this.

Simcraft's google page has some docs, but really I've never seen a really good write up either. I tend to go into the .simcraft files manually and play with them.

There is a thread somewhere here if you search on 'simcraft' where someone wrote up a bunch of tips and tricks on running it from the command line. One of the best is the ability to download your toon from armory and save it to a .simcraft file. When you do that, you can edit the file all you want.

You probably need to do more than specify your buffs, you may need to specify a completely different rotation. For example, Curse of Elements instead of Curse of Doom.

But with that said, if your gearing up via heroics, it does feel a little to me like you are using a nuclear warhead to drive a nail into a board if your going through the trouble to simcraft. A 5% difference in DPS when you are putting out 2500 DPS is not the same as the same 5% eeked out when you are putting out 7k or even 14k in a caster buff friendly fight.

October 01, 2009, 12:39 PM	#5 (permalink)
Trem Character Info Tremloc 80 Human Warlock Stormrage US PvE Guild: Iliad Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/13/58	Re: Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not! I looked it up for ya. do save=filename simcraft interations=10000 optimal_raid=1 wowhead=123456789 save=sylandra.simcraft

October 01, 2009, 01:31 PM	#6 (permalink)
Darklawdog Character Info Darklawdog 80 Gnome Warlock Medivh US PvE Guild: Imperìum Profile: ArmoryLite Talent Spec: dualspec	Re: Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not! Is there a way to set your own raid team and run that? I know how to run each individual and I put everyone's .simcraft file in a raid.simcraft. For some reason it doesn't seem to work though.

October 01, 2009, 08:37 PM	#7 (permalink)
Jenren22 Character Info Jenerena 80 Blood Elf Warlock Executus Euro PvP Guild: Deliverance Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/13/58	Re: Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not! I can't rely on simcraft until i can abolish the presence of a shaman, as this is going to have a massive influence on the value of haste for example. But i'm guessing most people who are 'experts' on simcraft will never have this problem because they probably raid 25man and have all the optimal buffs. But then again, things change on a daily basis, so even with the right setup, can you even rely on simcraft at all? There's not always a right and wrong answer after all.

October 01, 2009, 09:08 PM	#8 (permalink)
illicitdos Character Info Trigge 71 Gnome Warlock Emerald Dream US PvP Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 60/2/0	Re: Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not! You should check out this simcraft doc. How to Download, Compile and Run simcraft on Windows for Patch 3.1.2

October 02, 2009, 08:14 AM

#9 (permalink)

lilsteele

Character Info
lilsteele
80 Human Warlock
Terenas Euro PvE

Re: Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not!

A small raid setup, with optimal_raid=0. No shaman! 1000 iterations only however.

Quote:

DPS Ranking:
30192 100.0% Raid
6723 22.2% Warlock_T8_00_13_58
6454 21.4% Druid_T8_58_00_13
6090 20.1% Priest_T8_13_00_58
6042 20.0% Mage_T8_00_53_18
4921 16.3% Hunter_T8_54_12_05

Quote:

Scale Factors:
Druid_T8_58_00_13 Int=0.55 Spi=0.48 SP=1.40 Hit=2.84 Crit=1.08 Haste=1.34 Lag=0.00
Hunter_T8_54_12_05 Agi=0.77 Int=0.40 AP=0.38 ArPen=0.82 Hit=1.50 Crit=0.62 Haste=0.44 Wdps=3.18 Lag=0.00
Mage_T8_00_53_18 Int=0.41 Spi=0.84 SP=1.47 Hit=2.46 Crit=1.31 Haste=1.41 Lag=0.00
Priest_T8_13_00_58 Int=0.34 Spi=0.35 SP=1.44 Hit=2.01 Crit=1.01 Haste=0.72 Lag=0.00
Warlock_T8_00_13_58 Sta=0.00 Int=0.27 Spi=0.91 SP=1.40 Hit=2.76 Crit=0.76 Haste=1.44 Lag=0.00

Now we add an elemental shaman.

Quote:

DPS Ranking:
40913 100.0% Raid
7996 19.5% Warlock_T8_00_13_58
7456 18.2% Druid_T8_58_00_13
7158 17.5% Mage_T8_00_53_18
6891 16.8% Priest_T8_13_00_58
6324 15.4% Shaman_T8_57_14_00_ToW
5141 12.5% Hunter_T8_54_12_05

Quote:

Scale Factors:
Druid_T8_58_00_13 Int=0.69 Spi=0.53 SP=1.50 Hit=3.18 Crit=1.20 Haste=1.37 Lag=0.00
Hunter_T8_54_12_05 Agi=0.80 Int=0.42 AP=0.37 ArPen=0.85 Hit=1.58 Crit=0.59 Haste=0.41 Wdps=3.22 Lag=0.00
Mage_T8_00_53_18 Int=0.45 Spi=0.87 SP=1.61 Hit=2.95 Crit=1.51 Haste=1.60 Lag=0.00
Priest_T8_13_00_58 Int=0.33 Spi=0.37 SP=1.57 Hit=2.31 Crit=1.11 Haste=0.98 Lag=0.00
Shaman_T8_57_14_00_ToW Int=0.31 SP=1.35 Hit=2.71 Crit=0.87 Haste=1.27 Lag=0.00
Warlock_T8_00_13_58 Sta=0.00 Int=0.31 Spi=1.01 SP=1.52 Hit=3.46 Crit=0.85 Haste=1.19 Lag=0.00

Overall scaling goes up. This is to be expected. Haste goes down. Also kinda expected, though the effect might be amplified by some nonlinear scaling effects in haste.

So, how did I do this magic piece of work? I opened the Raid_T8.simcraft file that comes along with each download of simcraft, and deleted all classes from it that I didn't want in my simulation. Then run the file. It would be nice to have options to turn buffs on and off without having to carry along the classes through the simulation, but that doesn't seem possible at the moment. Cheers.

@Jen
What do you mean when you say "things change on a daily basis"? Simcraft has provided very stable results for warlocks over the last year that I followed the numbers.

October 04, 2009, 04:16 PM

#10 (permalink)

sylandra

Character Info
Syline
80 Human Warlock
Silvermoon Euro PvE
Guild: The Delicious Danes
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Talent Spec: 0/13/58

Re: Simcraft Optimal_raid...or not!

Quote:

Originally Posted by dyson

But with that said, if your gearing up via heroics, it does feel a little to me like you are using a nuclear warhead to drive a nail into a board if your going through the trouble to simcraft. A 5% difference in DPS when you are putting out 2500 DPS is not the same as the same 5% eeked out when you are putting out 7k or even 14k in a caster buff friendly fight.

If you are already decently raid geared then I following your logic it should make even less sense to use Simcraft since most upgrades at that gear-level are minor.

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