arena 2vs2

[Strazer]

Ok heres my issues lol..

Today I played 10 arena matches and only won 2 of them, why you may ask. Well it isnt because my gear is crap its far from it, but in actual fact all the teams we lost against today had a rogue and druid in. Is it the fact that wow has made the pvp so unbalanced that everybody who creates an alt for pvp rolls a rogue or druid.

I play with a ret pala that depends on crit damage and now the since everyone has s2 - s4 he hits for around 900 - 1500 damage. He is as geared as me and if you check my armory when im in pvp set you will see. Last season we pretty much pawned and only started to do arena 8 weeks from the end of s3.

cloak of noobs is op especially after fighting through the stun locks.. and having a druid hot the little sneaky bugger up who then vanishes while under cloud of noobs and returns hot'ed to nine and full on health.

With our damage nurfed due to more resil from s4 how can we compete against the rogue/druid combo?

I simply dont know what to do and yes we do as much cc but this mean naught to a rogue/druid combo....

Any thoughts on this.

[Gritz]

Rogue+Druid is difficult for all Warlock combos. No combo has more CC and silences on different DR timers as Rogue+Druid (KS, Gouge, Blind, Crip poison, Mace stun [if specced], Kick, Wound Poison, Cyclone, Roots, Bash, Pounce, etc). Especially as a double DPS with a Ret Pally, you're not going to win unless they screw up.

Also, S4 has the same amount of resilience as S2 and S3 - pretty much every opponent you face over 1600 will have 400-500 resilience (or T6 PvE DPS gear, which when combined with all the CC, is very difficult to counter).

[Strazer]

all true so pretty much im screwed lol

[Cynic]

Playing with a ret pally, yes. With a rogue or a druid on your own team, however.. and it's a totally different story.

Rogue/Lock, if played decently, counters Rogue/Druid. If your rogue gets one kidneyshot on the druid with him in caster form, it's game over between his burst and your dots and then silence/deathcoil/fear afterwards.

[El Tanakh]

Originally Posted by Cynic

With a rogue or a druid on your own team, however.. and it's a totally different story.

Agree with you Cynic, also, warlock/holy pally works very well if you can manage to silence cyclones and bugger the druid enough to avoid his CC on pally, and warlock/disc-holy priest may also work better.

Honestly I don't see warlock/retry pally winning against any of the standard combos, not even the subpar (standard) ones, the reason being you are a double DPS team with little CC and i don't remember pallys having enough burst to complement your 0/14/47 build.

What i am trying to say is that, yes, rogues and druids are currently OP in 2v2 (though i think rogue/priest and druid/warrior are at least just as strong), but your own talent tree and combo it's already a very bad choice, if you want to 2v2 with the pally a SL/SL with deep holy spec wold be much better.

[doogless]

Uh, actually Rogue/Druid is one of the hardest matchups for Lock/Rogue.

Your armory shows PvE gear, do you have PvP stuff too? Also resil hasn't increased since S2. Damage has gone up, not down.

And yeah, Ret Paladin/Destro Lock isn't a comp I'd expect to have any success with.

[El Tanakh]

WARNING: Offtopic chat for Doggless and Cynic

Hi doogless

Someday I'll make an alt on Kil'J to talk with you

Doogless fan #1

While you and Cynic are here, may i request both of you to look at the PvP instructional videos request for all specs - The Warlocks Den Forums thread, a couple of videos are dead.

Sorry for that.


Ontopic:

While rogue/druid will be difficult for lock/rogue, i still think they will have much better chances than retrypally/lock against it, and against every combo (that i can think off, really not that many)

[Cerosis]

I have had some luck this season with a 41/0/20 BM Hunter. The scatter shot trap and ferocious inspiration work wonders with CC and burst as well as Imp wing clip, deterance and beast within helps out a ton when hes being focused on.

Most teams we havn't fough before assume I'm SL/SL and it isn't untill after they have tasted a 3.5k shadowbolt do the realize that burning the hunter first was probably a bad idea.

Key to beating the rogue / x team with two non stealthers is to prevent the sap. Keep in combat and you remove 1/2 of the rogues long CC abilities. Finding the proper median between survivability and burst is important and while retadins can be great arena support friends their mana pool is too small for long drawn out fights (druid / disc priest and any mele class, lock, hunter) and their bubble can be dispelled by way too many classes now.

[El Tanakh]

Also, this is the link to Strazer armory, hope you don't feel like i am violating privacy or something, its just that, since you mentioned your gear, i though it was relevant for the tread.

Please do request it's erase if you feel its inappropriate.

*** Information added 10 Minutes and 43 Seconds later... ***

Originally Posted by Cerosis

The scatter shot trap and ferocious inspiration work wonders with CC and burst...

Yep, that's an odd combo that still has the potential to burst and CC. Gratz to you sir, it can't be easy.

Originally Posted by Cerosis

Key to beating the rogue / x team with two non stealthers is to prevent the sap. Keep in combat and you remove 1/2 of the rogues long CC abilities.

The thing here is that both you and your hunter can prevent that crazy blind/sap combos because you both have pets. A pally will need to trinket out of blind asap or lose.

Originally Posted by Cerosis

Finding the proper median between survivability and burst is important and while retadins can be great arena support friends their mana pool is too small for long drawn out fights (druid / disc priest and any mele class, lock, hunter) and their bubble can be dispelled by way too many classes now.

Well, rety can still do something without mana (almost the same as a manaless hunter) and their spells consume less MPS than the holy ones, but yes, you can't posibly go against a healer and hope to OOM him, so CC and burst are capital. Finally, and having little exprerience with retrys, i don't think bubble dispelling it's a great weakness, the thing is that the bubble in itself will slow your pally swings, making him hit like a level 10 murlock and providing an excellent chance to burn that destro lock ***.

[Strazer]

Yeh normally i was sl/sl in pvp but last season I had a 3v3 with a boomkin and disc priest so my destro build simply blew the faces off our opponents. Therefore I thought yeh it should be fine for 2v2 but as you have all pointed out that my main problem is pairing with a ret pala lol. Also i have 442 resil in my pvp set which the armory doesn't show, or may do now and im not bothered if you all look as im happy to receive all the advice i can.