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July 18, 2009, 07:32 PM
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#1 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Shadowbomber 80 Undead Warlock Crushridge US PvP Guild: I Break for Gnomes Talent Spec: 0/17/54 |
Arathi Basin 101
In this post I hope to share my basic understanding of AB and how I think it should be played in order to win. I might be wrong in my thinking in which case I leave it to you to correct me. But hear me out and tell me what you think. And as a quick note...I looked and didn't see any other post to this effect so if I am repeating past forums I'm sorry. I play Horde so this post is for those who also play horde. I dont think Alliance can benifit as much from this as the horde can. no offence. Assuming the teams are the roughly the same in competitiveness then a typical AB would not be easily 5 capped or one side would hold 4 to 1 bases...at least not for very long. In any case I argue the three most important locations to cap and hold to secure victory in AB are, if your Horde, the blacksmith, the lumber mill, and the farm. One could argue that holding any three is enough...I understand but strongly disagree. First off because I believe you would want three that share boarders and one can reach quickly enough to re-enforce and defend them when needed. The three I mentioned are touching. EX. If horde has taken Farm, LM, and Mine then they have three but are too spread out to spare extra defenders from another base. If the mine gets hit hard then those from LM would have a long way to run to get there and then a long way back. Probably those at LM would not go to help. Those at farm would. That still leaves those few at LM to cover both LM and now farm. Blacksmith is the most important to have and hold. It is central to all bases and provides the fastest responce location to all others. Also if you die then your not far from the action. Less running around, fast responce, etc. The second most important location to have and to hold is the Lumber mill. LM offers a few key elements to your teams chances to win. It is a high point allowing you to see the entire map. From this point it is easy to call out inc's as well leave LM quickly...jumping off the cliff. even though it is high a few classes can live through a fall. Mages (slow fall), pallies (bubble), priest (I think they can with levitate), any heal class can simply heal afterwards...etc. Again a fall is important for a fast escape or responce to somewhere else... Finally the farm is key simply cause it is the closest to your start location and because it shares a crossroads with both BS and LM. In our pre-mades we will try to keep a few defenders at each of these 3 bases and those who are left gather at the cross roads (right before the bridge to BS). From there they are seconds from LM, BS or Farm. If I might make a final point...We (my old PvP guild) have never lost an AB following this strat. Even when the Alli are 5 capping any other non premade AB played that day and in every other BG too. So stop going MINE people, especially you Horde...it is sucluded, harder to defend, and harder to escape from. Plus while your down there you have no idea of what is goin on with the rest of the map. Hit BS and or LM hard in the very beginning and hold em. I am also aware that most people who we encounter in BG's are flippin' retarded and do whatever the hell they want, even when it makes no sense. This is all assuming you have a half competent team... |
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July 18, 2009, 08:09 PM
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#2 (permalink) |
Status: Sit vis vobiscum.
Character Info
Supernex 80 Gnome Warlock Drak'thul US PvP Guild: Epic Drops Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/20/51 |
Re: Arathi Basin 101
A strong offense against this works well (if you are in a pre-made): -Have one person cap ST (or Farm if Horde), and 2 stealthers go to BS while the rest zerg and overcome LM. From there you leave one behind to cap LM while the rest quickly go the BS to zerg and overtake it as well (first have the stealthers open up to get them to call for help and have the rezzers go to BS instead of LM), then leave the stealthers behind to cap and hold BS). From here the group zergs Farm and once all enemies have been killed you leave one to cap while the rest camp the grave yard. From here you can send the person at ST to cap GM, and if it has anyone there you can send the stealthers from BS in to help while the person at LM goes to cover at BS. This has always made for very fast wins in AB for me - also very fun games too! Of course there will always be variances, but they are easy to overcome if you follow this basic gameplan.
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July 18, 2009, 08:37 PM
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#3 (permalink) | |
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Character Info
Shadowbomber 80 Undead Warlock Crushridge US PvP Guild: I Break for Gnomes Talent Spec: 0/17/54 |
Re: Arathi Basin 101
Quote:
Im not sure I followed exactly...So if I understand more or less what your saying is to zerg LM first, then BS, then the farm with a select few to hold off the other faction from capping BS before your team can take it... I hope I got it right. What I see wrong with that is I dont see a few stealthers holding off a strong BS hit from the other faction. especially if there is a healer with em. and the LM is looking like a big battle, favoring the zergers but i dont see it falling fast enough for them to push on to BS. This is of course if people follow my inital advice of hitting BS and LM strongly. There are flaws in everyones plans and plans thenselves go out the window in most BG's. One problem I see in your strat that is backed by many past experiences is that if a zerg rush gets stopped, then they are pretty much doomed. A strong fight at BS or LM could do that. I do see your strat working though...It has proven itself enough times in regular PUG BG's. Again I dont mean to discredit or offend so sorry if I come off that way. |
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July 18, 2009, 11:25 PM
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#4 (permalink) |
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Re: Arathi Basin 101
In my experience BG's can be fairly random places in general. There are certainly good strategies but there are many variables that can win or lose a game. Logically, just grabbing 3 flags and defending sounds like a great idea, and it certainly can work. The flaw in this though is that it leaves the other 2 flags completely free caps for the opposition. If the opposition are onto it they will take the freebies and because there is little-to-no pressure on those flags, they're free to use a larger force to take a 3rd or 4th flag. Larger forces rarely lose. Now there's no absolutes in a BG and every play has a counter play. It's quite uncommon though that each team will interpret and react to the opposition exactly and as one. In my opinion, strategies aside, the 2 biggest game deciding factors are: 1). Greater Force (more players) 2). Pre-made vs PUG In point 2. it doesn't really matter too much which strategy the pre-made are opting for, as the mere fact that they will have a tight plan and good communication will give them a substantial advantage over a PUG. Also premade's are rarely anything but very well geared. If a pre-made is winning most of the time, IMO that says more about the fact it is a premade than it has found the Holy Grail of strategies. A pre-made could probably still win with all sorts of interesting, non-opotimum strategies. IMO, and again this is really BG's in general (I apologise for this not being AB specific), one of the most important skills a player can have is being able to quickly identify which role they are personally best to fulfill, and to be able to change that role on the fly as required. I say this as the majority of players are PUG'ing into a BG. A good player needs to be able to switch between Defence, Offence, Capping, Midfield (killing/stalling the opposition), communication (calling incomings etc), distraction, decoy sacrifice, sticking with the pack, going solo etc - and importantly should be a Leader AND a Follower. Sorry that's not a specific AB strategy but IMO the strategy is secondary to the very fact of being a pre-made. Pre-made's start with a significant advantage. Much more difficult is playing effectively in a PUG with so many more unknown variables. Just my tuppen haypennies worth... ....Oh yeah.... ....and.... FOR THE ALLIANCE! ;) |
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July 19, 2009, 03:15 AM
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#5 (permalink) | |
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Status: Sit vis vobiscum.
Character Info
Supernex 80 Gnome Warlock Drak'thul US PvP Guild: Epic Drops Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/20/51 |
Re: Arathi Basin 101
Quote:
The stealthers at BS before we get there only open up as we are approaching, and then they stay when we leave, but since now 95% of the horde should be at the farm (or rezzing there), they will not have a hard time defending it, (and if by chance more came then they could handle, they can simply call it in over Vent and we can get there fast enough to handle it fairly easily.) As far getting our zerg stopped, well that just doesn't happen (or at least it hasn't yet). We typically do premades with three of our arena teams (plus fillers, usually PUG, but sometimes guildmates) - those being the PMR, RLS and 2347, we always have a filler grab ST, and the two stealthers are the rogues from the PMR & RLS, and the rest go to LM...etc. Everyone is geared well and used to playing together, using the extra advantages of Vent and a real gameplan and real teamwork. All this being said, however, works best when the opposing faction is trying to take the "advantage triangle", which is ST/Farm (depending on faction), BS and LM. When they are not, we have other techniques that work well too, but I was merely addressing a strong counter we have used for those who like to grab 3 bases and hold them. While I mentioned this as a pre-made, it can also work well with a full PUG so long as everyone works together as a team and communicates/follows instruction. ------------------- NOTE: For those of you who don't know the terms, PMR = Disc Priest, Frost Mage, Rogue; RLS = Resto Shaman, Lock (Destro works best IMO), Rogue; 2347 = Disc Priest, Holy Pally, MS Warrior, Elemental Shaman, Balance Druid.
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Last edited by Supernex; July 19, 2009 at 03:18 AM.. |
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July 19, 2009, 05:04 AM
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#6 (permalink) |
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Re: Arathi Basin 101
I was reading this and wishing i was Horde...Does anyone have a good Alliance strategy? cause we guys seem to be overrun by Horde in just about every BG..(Nagrand EU server).
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No matter what Blizzard has in store for Warlocks, one thing is for certain: Until they introduce “Kurt Cobain” as a playable class, no one —I repeat, NO ONE— will be able to kill themselves quite like a Warlock can. |
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July 19, 2009, 08:11 AM
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#7 (permalink) | |
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Status: Sit vis vobiscum.
Character Info
Supernex 80 Gnome Warlock Drak'thul US PvP Guild: Epic Drops Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/20/51 |
Re: Arathi Basin 101
Quote:
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July 19, 2009, 02:33 PM
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#8 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Shadowbomber 80 Undead Warlock Crushridge US PvP Guild: I Break for Gnomes Talent Spec: 0/17/54 |
Re: Arathi Basin 101
In my opinion, strategies aside, the 2 biggest game deciding factors are: 1). Greater Force (more players) 2). Pre-made vs PUG In point 2. it doesn't really matter too much which strategy the pre-made are opting for, as the mere fact that they will have a tight plan and good communication will give them a substantial advantage over a PUG. Also premade's are rarely anything but very well geared. If a pre-made is winning most of the time, IMO that says more about the fact it is a premade than it has found the Holy Grail of strategies. A pre-made could probably still win with all sorts of interesting, non-opotimum strategies. Sorry that's not a specific AB strategy but IMO the strategy is secondary to the very fact of being a pre-made. Pre-made's start with a significant advantage. Much more difficult is playing effectively in a PUG with so many more unknown variables. Just my tuppen haypennies worth... ....Oh yeah.... ....and.... FOR THE ALLIANCE! ;)[/QUOTE] Hmm...Ok I agree Pre-mades > PUG and higher numbers > smaller numbers. But that was never argument. Those were never the point of the discussion and most BG's have the same number of people for both sides starting the BG. They are not often pre-mades either...that being said I would like to argue the stratagies again. I suppose your right, any pre-made could win testing any non-optimum strat. Nex had a strat he believes works and is tested through his BG experiences. Zerging and keeping the pressure up...basically. It seems to work well enough for his pre-mades at least. It is my experience that is not the case and you said as much too. It leaves the other bases lightly defended. I think if that strat was done by any pre-made it would work...I guess for the sake of agruing the strats themselves it would be best to leave out pre-mades all together. I brought it up first so I am sorry. If you looked into my origional arguement I was stating that if the BG's were more or less equal in skill then it would come down to strat. I proposed holding 3 bases and stated which is the best. My underlining arguement is why LM > Mine. I dont think anyone can argue that fact. Therefor It would be wisest to take LM and BS for there stratigic locations, because it only makes sense to do so. So why EVER go mine...in the beggining that is??? You can do more for your team going BS, LM, stables, or Zerging with the group IMO. That is really all I am saying. You cant win with those two alone though so you have to have at least one more...Why not the closest one to your starting location. It is easy enough for even a PUG to get. There is a good counter vs both mine and Nex's strats a few buddies of mine and myself used last night AB'ing. From the start we cruzed straight over to stables (we are horde) and stole it before they capped it. This happens to us all the time and it sucks cuz we loose our GY early sending everyone that dies back to the beginning. This works against both strats by sending our dead clear back to the beginning weakening a Zergs strength and a defenders ability to hold a location. for too long with out help or renforcements. We disagree Nex but from Lock to Lock, you rock! Oh yeah, For the Horde! |
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July 19, 2009, 03:06 PM
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#9 (permalink) | |
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Status: Sit vis vobiscum.
Character Info
Supernex 80 Gnome Warlock Drak'thul US PvP Guild: Epic Drops Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/20/51 |
Re: Arathi Basin 101
Quote:
 Last night I decided to make an AB video somewhat for this purpose, but I couldn't get ANYONE in this PUG to buff, (let alone listen to strategy), so instead I just used it as an opportunity to show other locks where and how I use the Demonic Circle at the different nodes.  (Now all I have to do is find a place to host a high quality 4gig video for free, lol.)
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July 19, 2009, 03:22 PM
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#10 (permalink) | |
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Character Info
Azraeleth 80 Undead Warlock Ravenholdt Euro RP PvP Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/20/51 |
Re: Arathi Basin 101
Quote:
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