do demon spec locks bring more to the table?

[dogwatch]

Was in a group this weekend with a geared destro lock. He would always start off every fight by saccing his succubbis never once had his pet out alive.

He was top on DPS, not a big suprise there. However turns out that I was the one doing all the dirty work; banishing, enslaving, pulling out my Felguard,Imp, Succy, or VW for various mobs and bosses, basically you can say a ton of CC management with my pets. the destro spec lock was an experienced player but what he was just mostly doing is just kicking back and spamming sbolts.

It got me to wondering. Is it really "helping" the group the most by just putting out the maximum DPS or is the extensive usage of pets make the demon spec more valuable to a raid or instance. Any opinons on this matter?

[Oaken]

The 0/21/40 lock has more imp. SB uptime than the demo-lock, on the other hand he is alot more fragile. Other than that a demo-lock can perform alot better in both t5 and starting of t6 content.

[Beyondfear]

You shouldn't be the one to do all the work. This destro lock seems to be a slacker and just let you do everything. Unless you agreed to it. You both should have been splitting the responsibilities.

[Umbralpuff]

I wouldn't think spamming shadowbolts would preclude someone from tossing out a banish now and then...so yes it sounds like you may have gotten the short end of the dps stick there.

Of course, anyone in that group should probably know better than to judge someone's usefulness soley by the damage meter. Sometimes when I play my SPriest, I'm on MC duty, and that often means I'm nerfing my dps a bit. I doubt anyone would call me out for not contributing based on the damage meter though.

[Night Owl]

Originally Posted by Beyondfear

You shouldn't be the one to do all the work. This destro lock seems to be a slacker and just let you do everything. Unless you agreed to it. You both should have been splitting the responsibilities.

I don't think it is fair to call the destro lock a slacker. It sounds like he or she did the job that was asked of them. Make lots of dps to bring the boss down.

It is widely understood when you take a destro lock into a raid, he or she will not have his or her minion out. Everyone understands this going in. The entire build centers around saccing the minion for the damage buff it provides. It's foolish to keep it out.

If you have chosen to spec affliction, you can expect to have certain things asked of you in a raid that people know affliction locks can provide. Likewise, if you have specced demonology, you can expect certain other things to be expected of you, among which will be crowd control. I am specced destro, and I know going in that I am expected to be topping damage charts. That's my job. If I don't get it done, I won't be invited back. And if someone aksed me to keep it out, I'd ask them why they invited me in the first place.

Everyone in the raid has a job. If you don't want to do CC, then I would suggest speccing in destro or some other build. When there are two locks in the raid, and one of them clearly has to gimp themselves badly to do cc, whiile the other is practically designed for it, it makes no sense to ask the first one to hamper the entire raid's viability to make them do it.

[crypticchris]

Ya looks like he"s just being lazzzy! IM guessing you never killed with this lock before ,and i no how frigin annoying and can get sometimes:angry:.But ask politely what his problem is sometimes it could be somthing stupid.Remeber this is a game guys it suppose to be fun not aggrovating and annoying!:happy:

[Necronomis]

Completely disagree with splitting duties. You should do everything in your power to make sure that other lock can spam SBolts til the cow's come home. More crits = more ISB (he gains more uptime from Backlash/Devastation) which directly benefits you and the rest of the raid's shadow users (more importantly, the shadowpriests).

If you called him a slacker and split up duties that you've been handling thus far, you'd have two people gimping their DPS instead of one. That = fail. Less is lost by you having to enslave/banish, whatever. Your demon does damage and you gain a lot by having him/her out. You also should have your dots running. The destro lock has no dots. If he's not spamming shadowbolts he's basically sucks.

Demo really doesn't bring any raid utility and is purely an overall damage spec (much like affliction but with the benefit of ISB) and gives you a much more resilient warlock.

[Beyondfear]

Maybe those were hasty words in calling the destro lock a slacker. But since I don't know the exact situation I can't say. But if he or she didn't help banish if there were more than 2 demons...that's pretty lazy.

[Night Owl]

"Maybe those were hasty words in calling the destro lock a slacker. But since I don't know the exact situation I can't say. But if he or she didn't help banish if there were more than 2 demons...that's pretty lazy."

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I think we're on common ground there. As destro, I am often asked to do banishing, fearing, and enslaving. But CC with a minion out as destro is right out, as far as I'm concerned. The rest of these things require no minion and very little SB downtime, so it isn't unreasonable to ask any lock to do these things. It also hasn't been noted what the actual raid LEADER was asking of people. Because the raid leader makes the decisions most of the time to give directions as to who needs to be CC'ing what. Perhaps the RL was asking the demo spec to do all the CC?? If that's the case, then the destro was doing exactly what was asked of him or her. Perhaps the OP should ask the RL what orders were given, instead of blaming the destro lock for being lazy.

I don't know. I wasn't there. But I think if I'd have been the RL, with those two specs at my disposal, I'd want that destro lock hurling shadow bolts as frequently as possible, and I'd be asking the demo to do the "dirty work" of CC'ing as much as possible. It only makes sense. Bosses don't tip over without dps AND crowd control.

[wrath64]

Originally Posted by Necronomis

Completely disagree with splitting duties. You should do everything in your power to make sure that other lock can spam SBolts til the cow's come home. More crits = more ISB (he gains more uptime from Backlash/Devastation) which directly benefits you and the rest of the raid's shadow users (more importantly, the shadowpriests).

If you called him a slacker and split up duties that you've been handling thus far, you'd have two people gimping their DPS instead of one. That = fail. Less is lost by you having to enslave/banish, whatever. Your demon does damage and you gain a lot by having him/her out. You also should have your dots running. The destro lock has no dots. If he's not spamming shadowbolts he's basically sucks.

I totally agree!