[akm0877]

O.k. guys need your opinions about something. Let me start by stating I dont consider myself a hardcore raider ( i think) but i'm playing in a horde guild on the Ravenholdt server and starting to get aggrevated with our progression rate. The guild i'm in is pretty relaxed but a majority of the members raid on a regular basis ( 4 days a week) , this being said I have a couple of questions:

1. What's a reasonable time frame (on avg) your guild should be progressing between Tier levels? Our guild is working on ZA...for quite a while and progress seems to have hit a wall. Everyone's gear is adequate but after 3 months the timed event should be attainable by now shouldn't it? ( makeup is constant for 10 man's for most part and dps doen't appear to be an issue)


2. My secon question, I guess it's more of a rant but consumables is my second issue. Like I stated above this guild is pretty relaxed... but, is it too much to request that guild member's have what they need? My professions are embarrasingly low, therefore 0 gold comes from them, but I still do isle dailies and have enuff cash to buff myself up. Am I expecting too much for other's too do the same?


3. My last question is regarding raid fights in general. On our guild web site video's are posted under raid signups that we will be attempting that day... yet no one seems to look at em therefore raids that we have been doin for a while ( Maulgar for example ) ends up taking much longer because explanations, and the pull need to be explained... I understand the pull is a pain in the arse but is doing a minimal amount of research too much to ask? The resources are supplied, all ya gotta do is click the links...

Am I being to anal about this considering it's just a game ? i'd like to see some T-6 content at least before the expansion releases...

[Barkle]

Sounds awfully familiar. A lot of guilds struggle with this, especially those that are trying to raid as a casual/relaxed guild. I've always felt it was simply that contrary to what most people say, they value gear over progress. A lot of people want the gear, but don't want to work for it. Ever notice how many people sign up for bosses you know you can kill, and how few sign up to learn the new boss?

Our guild always had a policy that if you are invited to a raid, you are expected to buff your character to the fullest.
This includes:

• either two appropriate elixirs or one appropriate flask
• buff food (stam/AP/spell power/healing, etc)
• weapon buff (wizard/mana oil, poisons, sharpening stones)
• have ALL gear enchanted appropriately (armor kits are not appropriate enchants)
• appropriate spec (don't show up to raid SL/SL)

At one point, we had to actually assign an officer to check everyone before the raid. We ended up benching one or two people for a period of two weeks to get the point across.

Unfortunately, you can't make people do what they don't want to do. It is an incredibly frustrating situation. You didn't give much info about why you are failing the event timer. What is happening?

[Marsyx]

If people are not buffing to the fullest then I would say dps, healing, and melee are all an issue. It is very frustrating even when fully buffed to fail at some of the most basic aspects of raiding. My guild, for instance, has cleared ZA, but we're still working on timed runs. We can get three, but have yet to achieve the fourth. We've hit a wall too and that frustration can make you want to slack off. Its hard to stay motivated...and even worse now with Wrath of the Lich King nearing the horizon.

[akm0877]

Originally Posted by Barkle

You didn't give much info about why you are failing the event timer. What is happening?

Don't knoe exactly why to be honest, attention issues just as much buff issues imo. People running into balls on Dragonhawk, whole raid isnt buffed unless pots are shared I believe is largest problem tho.

[Thralock]

I suggest you start running WWS reports to analysis your raid and player performance.

[MrUnderpants]

Originally Posted by Thralock

I suggest you start running WWS reports to analysis your raid and player performance.

Agreed....I found that sooooo useful when I was suffering from mediocre dps in 25 mans...i did that and regemmed, tweaked my spec abit and retooled my spell rotation...went from 13th to 15th to consistently top 5.

[Coud]

tbh the bear run is tuned for t6 equiped people. that said we first started getting bears when we killed just about everything in SSC / TK bar vash / kael . we consistently got bears post 2.4 when we entered T6 as well as started gearing via badges. honestly there's really no reason why you can't get bears now given the amount of decent armor avaliable now. as others have suggested, run WWS to see what's going wrong... poor dps lack of heals etc

the other 2 points are mainly motivational imo. altho i can perfectly understand tanks / healers having a hard time doing dailies in 30min if they don't have a dps alt and since plate repairs can cost upward to 50g when zeroed + 50 to 60g for flask ( on my server ). sometimes they just don't have funds.

it sux if people aren't willing to put in the effort but there's really nothing you can do about it.

[Guph]

1. Depends on the spread of "achievment motivation". Usually one moves up when one has reached a certain gear goal (and therefore level) and is bored to tears with the current encounters.
2. Well, did you declare the guild to be a raiding guild? If so, I'd expect everyone to do their best instead of having some half-arsed efforts frustrate every serious raider. It is NOT too much to do Isle Dailies, at least. We usually set up a daily-doing-working-group-thing with 1 DPS, 1 Healer and 1 Tank. Works quite well..Tank pulls the whole ship (bombing run 1 assumed), Healer heals a bit, DPS does what we always do. Rushmooming!
3. Again, it's a question of motivation - or rather the lack of. If this was happening to me, I'd either try to convince the members to try harder - or just /gquit.

[lockylock]

I'm in a similiar situation. I had the option of joining a heavy raiding guild (full of not so nice people) or joining a guild that literally crawls with progress but everyone is so supportive and nice. I've considered maybe changing realms because the other guilds on my server don't seem to be quite up to snuff. I try to stay positive, but this week alone we tried to do the timed ZA event (like we did last week and the week before) and WIPED 5 times on the eagle guy. When we schedule runs, not everyone shows up and I look like the "bad guy" when I call them out. Many just say they forgot or changed their minds. I need a serious raiding guild, but I won't be finding it on this realm. I want a combination of intelligent people who more or less know the fights but are willing to learn and open to try new things. Most of all, being able to play with kind people. I'm a firm believer in that there is never one answer to any question or problem.

I am one frustrated warlock but i'm glad I found this thread so that I could find others who may be in the same or similiar situation as me. Thank you all for sharing

[Mehrunezzz]

to the OP i feel your pain. [lack of] guild progression is why my warlock is on perma pvp status until Wrath of the Lich King. we got our 1st kara grp geared, then our 2nd, then 3rd, then 4th, yet we still are not able to get 25 people together to do mags/gruul's and above. I've been thru ssc/tk with another guild and i KNOW that my guild could run thru that content fairly quickly but at the rate we are progressing people will be endgame in Wrath of the Lich King before we even down gruul so i'm like "what's the point?" Unless you are lucky enough or good enough to earn a regular spot in a guild that raids semi to totally hardcore, endgame raiding at this stage of The Burning Crusade is worthless. do your dailies, save up your gold, max your professions, and bank pvp honor until Wrath of the Lich King. and play force unleashed lolz it's crunk.