A Warlock's Place

[Aly]

First time poster here.

Wanted to get some thoughts from you all.

The high-end raiding guilds seem to consistently bring 1-3 locks per raid. This must be for a reason. Our guild only usually has 2-4 per raid, we take more if no other dps class is available.

IMO, a warlock's main goal in a raid.. is to supply CoE,CoR,and CoS (if poss). We also have a nice buff with imp imp which allows the tank to stay alive that much longer. As well as HS and SS and doing as much damage as we can without drawing aggro.

We have no threat reducing talents(fetish of the sand reaver doesnt really count)...and until we get some plagueheart set bonuses or The Burning Crusade is realeased....shouldn't our main focus be survivability? So that we are at least able to supply above mentioned buffs and debuffs as long as possible?

It seems logical to me that the only viable spec available at this time would be MD/Ruin if you are strictly a RAID PVE'r which I am. When working on trash etc. you could sacc a succy or and imp(for some hellfire fun), but when it comes boss time...pull out the imp imp for some tank loving time =)

We are soon starting attempts on C'thun and only have Anub, Raz, Faerlina, (and almost Noth) down so far in Naxx. SM/Ruin and DS/Ruin seem to be the flavor of the month but it seems to me they lack some crucial bonuses(yes I know that you can crank out the damage with these specs, but truthfully we are not there for that purpose)

Any thoughts appreciated on whether I am on track with this or just a warlock who has lost her heart for the class.

[Milquetoast]

You're on track from the perspective of treating us as a "raid utility" class. I myself specced MD/Ruin a while back to improve my survivability in more agro-sensitive fights. With plenty of "+spell damage" I crank out as much DPS as I safely can, but I'm happy with the supporting role I've chosen. I curse, give my group Blood Pact, dispense improved healthstones to the tanks, and ensure that the right people are SS'ed. Once the fight starts my role is to add to the DPS, but also to stay alive (if I die my imp does too, and the tank's stamina buff goes with it).
However, not everyone likes to play from the utility perspective. As a class we are capable of pumping out some very serious DPS as well. My guild usually shoots for 1 or 2 utility locks per raid and a couple of DPS locks as well.
The strength of our class isn't in any certain build, but in our versatility -- hence carrying a mix of builds into a raid is often the best approach.

[unholyguy]

too much generaility

Warlocks, just like mages, shift from utility to dps depending on the boss you are fighting. Think Garr versus Chromaggus

[Lady V]

I thought about this question too when I began raiding.

I think you are selling warlocks short when you religate our utility to our debuffs and our imp. A good warlock can do the Debuff, have the imp (if needed) give out HS and still out Dps most classes.

When the mages have all blown up and the rogues are dead from lack of healing the warlocks are left, doing our sustained dps, taking up positions 2-5 on KTM and pulling out the 10 people left standing kills.

Don't down play the DPS and the hard core durability that are hallmarks of our class.

[Riel]

I'm getting a bit tired of this discussion. Sure, mages and rogues do more damage than us. But we do more damage than hunters.

With the right skills and equal gear you can still do a lot of damage. I'm usually among the rogues and behind the mages on the list.

The Burning Crusade will also change a lot. Even patch 2.0 will change stuff.

[Coolspoon]

Originally Posted by Riel

The Burning Crusade will also change a lot. Even patch 2.0 will change stuff.

40 debuff slots ftw! (btw only rogues and the occasional dps warrior can beat me, but then, im usually the only caster on the top ten, so maybe our mages and other locks suck in general? )

[Warloch]

I gotta be honest here. I am new to 20 man 40 man raids but I am not in the top 10 on the damage meters. I care less about MY DPS I have the talents and skills to better able other classes to do more damage, and down the mobs quicker.....When and if my raid leader asks for more DPS I know I can deliver, but till he asks I will just support and help other kill the mobs faster. If I want DPS I will play my Rogue or my Mage. But I love my Warlock more.

[Yers]

I have been looking for thread related to DPS and Damage meters, this is the one I though can fit better for my question, what do you guys do during trash fights to maximize your damage dealing?

[Druas]

I have been raiding 2-3 times per week since January in Blackrock Mountain and I can offer you the following observations:
- When I was Master Demonologist, I was usually around 20/40 in damage and only that high by judicious use of potions and buffs. I used Cerebral Cortex Compound, Flask of Supreme Power, Sagefish Delight, Elixir of Shadow Power, Greater Arcane Elixir and I would sacrifice my Succubus whenever we fought Ragnaros.
- With my imp out on other bosses, the aggro reduction meant that I was usually last to die when we had a wipe.
- Frost Mages are much greater damage dealers in Blackrock Mountain and the best thing we can do is help them by putting Curse of Elements up early.
- As our raid got better equiped, having aggro reduction was not so important since the Mages are always far ahead of warlocks in damage and thus aggro. I switched to Shadow Mastery/Ruin.
- With SM/R, I usually end up ~12/40 behind rogues, mages, and some hunters. While it theoretically means we finish bosses sooner, I am not sure my raidmates like the change since I no longer have the 1320 sized HS that so often let our tanks have 3 Healthstones per fight. In fact, most of our warlocks respec'd to SM/R and now almost everyone has generic 1200 warlock candy and that is definately not so positive for tanks.
- I think we are very useful on raids for curses, DPS and crowd control. Without timely banishes, some pulls become painful. I enjoy our role in raids, at least in Blackrock Mountain. Warlocks raiding AQ40 or Naxx will have to share their experiences, it may be different.

- Druas

[unholyguy]

Druas, remeber that with the next patch we get 10% threat reduction talents.

Mages threat reduction gets nerfed down to 10-12% depending on spec. So we are basically on par with mages for threat reduction .

As far as your comment about frost mages, we are currently killing Nef in BWL and i keep up with frost mages. The reason you don't keep up is you only have +318 damage which is way way low. Felheart sucks, loose it.

Once The Burning Crusade comes out and we get soul shatter we actually have better threat reduction then mages.