Nightfall vs Shadowburn - Page 3 - The Warlocks Den

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The Warlocks Den - WoW Warlock Discussions » Discussion Forums » Spells, Talents and DPS Discussion » Individual Talent Discussions » Nightfall vs Shadowburn

Individual Talent Discussions In-depth discussion, information and analysis on a talent by talent basis. Please read the "About this section" thread before replying to any threads.

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January 29, 2007, 12:17 AM	#21 (permalink)
Canadianpimp Character Info Kobekid 80 Human Warlock Kilrogg US PvE Guild: Good With Ketchup Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/13/58	Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn? What exactly are you focusing on? Raiding? PvP? 5 mans and 10 mans?

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January 29, 2007, 08:42 AM	#22 (permalink)
xdiesp	Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn? Canadianpimp: I do solo grinding,5 man quests and 5 man instances I wonder if,in a dots+sb spamming situation,the improved drain life + improved corruption + improved Curse of Agony + nightfall DPS improvements would beat those of improved shadowbolt + bane + shadowburn. My idea of a build is of either 9/41/11 or 20/41/0.

January 30, 2007, 06:19 AM	#23 (permalink)
DoomCzar Character Info DoomCzar 70 Undead Warlock Frostmane US PvP Guild: F U B A R Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/7/54	Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn? Between the two, 9/41/11. @Fallenkirmit: Pardon, kind supposedly intelligent gnomething: WHY THE CRAP WOULD YOU BE DRAIN TANKING WITH A FELGUARD? Felguard=Less DPS than a succy. This is undebatable. Oh well. At least you understand that you have the least DPS of the three trees, but arguably the most utility. But seriously... if your pet isn't taking many hits, shouldn't it be the one that actually deals the most DPS?

January 30, 2007, 07:13 AM	#24 (permalink)
Farbauti	Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn? this is not the first time i hear that succy i better dps than the FG. what i dont understand is how people come to this conclusion. first off. i dont have improved succy, but then again that would only improve her lash of pain. when i look at the pet-char sheat and compare dps, his (FG) is about 4 dps higher. as far as i know the pet abilities are not taken into account into this dps number, but even if they were taken into account and you had improved succy his several abilities would make up for it, especially if he is tanking (demonic frenzy comes into mind). can anyone be kind enough to explai this??

January 30, 2007, 08:31 AM	#25 (permalink)
DoomCzar Character Info DoomCzar 70 Undead Warlock Frostmane US PvP Guild: F U B A R Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/7/54	Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn? People come to this conclusion BECAUSE IT'S TRUE. Go get yourself a DPS tracker mod. I could "explai" it, but your own eyes would be far better at "explai[-ing]" it to you. I dunno what the crap you're talking about, "pet-char sheat," I think you mean the character info screen/sheet for the pet. Last I checked, this definitely does not include attack speed. Also, there is no "DPS Statistic" on this window. Demonic Frenzy takes time to build up, so IF a FG that hit a target five times dealt near the same DPS as a succy, it would still have to slowly build up... And how often does a mob stay alive long enough for a FG to hit it FIVE TIMES? If you find that mobs are staying alive long enough for a FG to hit it more than 5 times, you are dealing shitty dps, or grinding the wrong mobs. Shitty dps is always a possibility with Demo locks though...

January 30, 2007, 09:40 AM

#26 (permalink)

Farbauti

Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoomCzar

I dunno what the crap you're talking about, "pet-char sheat," I think you mean the character info screen/sheet for the pet. Last I checked, this definitely does not include attack speed. Also, there is no "DPS Statistic" on this window.

ignoring the ****y attitude, i will try to reply curtly. yes i do mean the character info screen for the pet. and yes there is DPS statistics if you just let your mouse hoover over the damage statistics.

p.s. sorry xdiesp for taking this into your thread. i would probably go with nightfall given the option but then again i have never ventured into destruction

Last edited by Farbauti; January 30, 2007 at 09:46 AM..

January 30, 2007, 02:29 PM	#27 (permalink)
minie Character Info Minie 70 Gnome Warlock Eldre'Thalas US PvE Guild: Plundercats Profile: CTProfile	Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn? Damn Doomczar, did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed or something? There's really no need to be that hateful. xdiesp, I'm working towards the NF/FG build right now. Granted, all I've been doing is solo and 5 mans, but I find I'm very rarely using SB right now. With no points in bane, and switching out +shadow for +damage, it seems like I'm getting as much dps out of incinerate as I was SB. Plus, on trash in 5 mans, you generally don't have time for 2 SB (sometimes not even 1). I personally don't feel like I'm losing much without bane. And since I'm not casting SBs very often, imp SB seems like a waste. With 9/41/11, you're going to miss out on reach in either tree, and either suppression or -threat talent in aff, and the -threat in destro. The minus threat may not be as big of a deal with soulshatter, but in the later 5 mans/raiding it's still going to be nice. I'll probably respec 4 or 5 times once we start raiding, but as long as it's just 5 mans, I'll stick w/ my felguard. Topping damage meters really isn't the main thing (even though when I combine damage w/ my pet I'm 1 or 2). Sure, your succubus may be more damage, but she can't tank the mob that's going after the priest. Sometimes utility is more important that topping the charts

January 30, 2007, 03:32 PM

#28 (permalink)

Akasha

Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn?

Yes Doomczar

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoomCzar

@Fallenkirmit:
Pardon, kind supposedly intelligent gnomething: WHY THE CRAP WOULD YOU BE DRAIN TANKING WITH A FELGUARD? Felguard=Less DPS than a succy. This is undebatable. Oh well. At least you understand that you have the least DPS of the three trees, but arguably the most utility. But seriously... if your pet isn't taking many hits, shouldn't it be the one that actually deals the most DPS?

Instead of concentrating on your all caps yelling, perhaps you should take some time to actually read some of the other helpful posts on this forum. There are a few talking about how the Felguard is in fact a great DPS pet and even some that mention how it's on par if not more damage than the Succubus. I use my Felguard all the time, and I drain life both to return mine after I life tapped as well as damage the mob... do you have a problem with that as well?

I find it interesting Doomczar that you make a comment defending the destruction tree in another thread such as "whoever bashed the destro tree with the response "Why not roll a mage?" was just plain ignorant" yet you flip the coin and attack someone for choosing to play a Demonology tree the way they want to.

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Last edited by Akasha; January 30, 2007 at 03:36 PM..

January 30, 2007, 03:39 PM

#29 (permalink)

Krigan

Character Info
Krigan
70 Undead Warlock
Skullcrusher US PvP
Guild: Armageddon
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Talent Spec: 0/40/21

Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoomCzar

People come to this conclusion BECAUSE IT'S TRUE. Go get yourself a DPS tracker mod. I could "explai" it, but your own eyes would be far better at "explai[-ing]" it to you.

I dunno what the crap you're talking about, "pet-char sheat," I think you mean the character info screen/sheet for the pet. Last I checked, this definitely does not include attack speed. Also, there is no "DPS Statistic" on this window.

Demonic Frenzy takes time to build up, so IF a FG that hit a target five times dealt near the same DPS as a succy, it would still have to slowly build up... And how often does a mob stay alive long enough for a FG to hit it FIVE TIMES? If you find that mobs are staying alive long enough for a FG to hit it more than 5 times, you are dealing shitty dps, or grinding the wrong mobs. Shitty dps is always a possibility with Demo locks though...

Since you gave no real information here & did'nt even bother to post your level or build i have to assume you don't know what you are talking about. You spent most of your posts making an ass out of yourself instead of trying to make a valid point. If you had actually spent any real time testing builds you would know that all three trees are very good. It basically depends on playstyle which is best for you. Yes I am demo spec now but cant wait to try a level 70 destruction build & a month or two after that will try a 70 affliction spec. As far as succy being higher dps, if true thats a nice bonus for her but she still can't hold aggro or tank some instance bosses like a felguard can do. Can you gather 4-5 mobs around a succy and aoe them down? Of course succy is a great pet and has her uses seduce is a wonderful abillity. When I am destruction spec I will have her out a lot, almost as much as my felhunter I suspect.

In the future when I see a post by DoomCzar my first thought will be
Ewww, DoomCzar

January 31, 2007, 08:38 PM	#30 (permalink)
DoomCzar Character Info DoomCzar 70 Undead Warlock Frostmane US PvP Guild: F U B A R Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/7/54	Re: 70 FG build: choose,Nightfall or Shadowburn? Ewww DoomCzar indeed! If anyone can give me concrete evidence that the FG does more DPS in a 12 second span than the succy, I will happily chew off my foot and eat it. As for tanking a few mobs and letting you AoE them, I don't really see how that's relevant to the act of Drain Tanking. Akasha, I'm going to try something new on your forums. Civility. It's not that he's playing a spec the way he wants to, it's that he's subscribing to this "ZOMG THE FG IS AMAZING" philosophy that every other 'lock has. I'm positive that, beyond a shadow of a doubt, the succy is a better pet for drain tanking. The imp would make sense too, with it's fire shield, stam buff, and decent dps. But unless he's on an RP server, there isn't really much reason to use a FG when drain tanking.

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