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May 14, 2009, 06:32 PM
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#171 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Néphilium 80 Human Warlock Mal' Ganis US PvE |
Re: Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs
I've played with the replenish and with out.....not very beneficial. Just my two cents. Ship |
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May 16, 2009, 05:19 AM
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#172 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Comino 80 Human Warlock Outland Euro PvE Guild: Game Sense Profile: WoW Rankings Talent Spec: 53/01/17 |
Re: Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs
my main spec is affliction and I love it to bits but would like my second spec  before patch 3.1 I was specced 00/41/30 and it was quite good and used to get good dps. After the patch with decimation I cannot get the grip of the weaving and my dps is very much low. What othe spec do you recommend besides affliction for raids ? |
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May 16, 2009, 06:08 AM
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#173 (permalink) |
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Character Info
lilsteele 80 Human Warlock Terenas Euro PvE |
Re: Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs
41/30 has very high dps even before you start with the soulfire weaving. There might be other reasons why your dps is lower now. The only spec besides affliction that doesn't use decimation is deep destruction, something along the lines of 03/13/55. While it shows on the last place in the simulations, I still think its a viable raiding spec, since the differences are relatively small. And it might be good to learn playing this spec since there's a chance that it gets buffed with patch 3.1.2. |
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May 18, 2009, 03:54 PM
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#174 (permalink) | |
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Re: Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs
Quote:
Regarding the destro specc...i got some mates (mages and locks  ) wich kinda try different speccs and glyphs on various fights in many different circumstances. Been searching for a deep destro build that would make my dps competitive towards equally skilled warlocks (too sad there aint many kicking on dps meters these days on dragonmaw  ) wich chose either 53/1/17 or 0/41/30. Tryed the chaosbolt way with many different glyphs, tested it on several encounters (tested on the encounters where we do something more then just nuke 1 target to death, but where we have to switch dps focus from time to time, move/avoid aoe, stop dps etc.) Came out that Chaos Bolt is sacrificable for some more stuff in Demonology, and yet there were some things in the demo tree that are replaceable by some things in the deep destro tree. - 1: why to get a pimped Chaosbolt if i can get extra damage for my imp and master conjuror? - 2: why to get a Demonic knowledge instead of shadow n flames? (where 20% of more spellpower for incinerate > 5% damage n crit from MD) - 3: Backdraft gives a direct 30% faster dps on 3 spells, why not pick it over decimation since it works for 100% of the fight and not 35% only? So i came out with this thing: Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft 0/22/49 Now, before you all start the flameing towards me i'd tell you to try it out by useing a trick (proudly made by myself  ).Backdrafting doesnt have its max potential while bloodlust is up, thats 1 point. With exagerated haste like i had before i tryed that (949 haste with spellstone) i inevitabely ran into the "2 fast cast" issue, so i came out with this... My weapon atm is Life n Death: great, i put spellstone on it, where i get some nice percentage on my haste. My trinket proccs, i get 505 haste while backdraft is up, so what now? I equip my Soul blade from KT 10 man, wich i enchanted with Firestone before. What do i get? an increase on my direct damage by 1%, increased crit by 4%. Backdraft goes off, fine. I macro this thingie to get my Life n Death back to my mainhand with its respective Spellstone. Now you might be asking "why not go for pure haste all the way long?" Simple: With the haste i run with atm, Backdraft + 505 haste procc or Bloodlust aint as good as a 1% direct damage increase and 4% crit. So bascally i went to a Emalon 10 man with 2 mates of mine, both warlocks to try it out, 1 was chaosbolt specc and the other FG/ES. Turned out that i did on that fight 4.9k (didnt ave the best caster dps setup ) and they were both below me by 600-750 dps the whole fight. Then we reached the execution phase where they got a bit up, where in the end the difference was 380 more dps for me vs the FG/ES lock, and 701 towards the Chaosbolt lock.We were all running with 4xt 7.5 and full 25 man gear, all useing dieing curse + another trinket (in my case the maexxna 10 man trinket, in their case the sartharion 25 man trinket). Showed up that by useing 2 different weapons with their respective stones and switching them between global cooldowns proved to be more effective then a pure haste boost. So was basically Makeing that trick in the colldown between conflagrate and incinerate, and tried to use the spellstone cnchanted weapon each time i went for a curse, corruption or immolate. Now we are all running with the specc i made, but still have some problems setting decent macros for weapons switching between conflagrates and refreshing dots. So as i see you definitely got a good picture about your class, i'd like to know if you can help me work it out to get the best out of it, since is till mess up a bit while switching the weps and makeing it get switched automatically upon trinket proccs (this goes to any1 reading this thread and not llsteel only ) Appears to me as something that blizzard didnt think about or an in combat game mechanic they didnt predict as usable. Still my performance in that try wasnt the best, messed up the cycling a bit and brought my hit to 14.9%, so had a few missis at crucial points. Hope to hear viable info and tips from any1 that can make it easier to play. Cheers and thanks in advance for your help and support. 
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May 18, 2009, 04:44 PM
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#175 (permalink) | |
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Re: Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs
Quote:
Lots of things to consider. I suppose it's only really effective when you have 2 weapons that are very close dpswise, as L&D and Soulblade are. Do you switch to the firestone weapon during bloodlust/heroism regardless of trinket procs? Do you switch for every haste trinket proc? Or do you only switch when both the trink and Bloodlust are active? Backdraft is every 10 seconds (Played perfectly), do you switch weapons every backdraft? I'm not sure I believe this weapon switching really helps, but I'm not sure it doesn't either. My gut says whatever gains you can milk out of weapon switching are eclipsed by you running 22/49, which is basically an inferior spec. Have you tried the switching with other builds? None of the more accepted raiding builds have improved stones and backlash; is the benefit of switching negligible without both those talents you think? Too bad the weapons are unique and you can't have 2 of the same one. Sorry my reply has more questions than answers, but this weapon switching sounds intriging, and you're the first person I've ever heard of who uses it. Last edited by Koldfeat; May 18, 2009 at 05:00 PM.. |
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May 18, 2009, 06:34 PM
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#176 (permalink) | |
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Re: Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs
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, since i have so many as well, had only 2 days of testing and still trying to sort it out. About the 505 haste trinket procc, i switch to firestone while backdraft is active, as soon as i fire the 3rd incinerate i switch back to spellstone weapon. But i rly suggest you to try it out yourself, maybe you wont find the answers from me since i'm still trying to find if its best to go 3/3 in empowered imp and 3/5 in fire and brimstone, or trying to find the so called "optimal" haste. We dont have an optimal haste like mages got for arcane specc, guess it changes from playstyle and mostly to stuff as decimation and backdraft.About the weapons DPS value you'r right i guess, for example TTT with spellstone against LnD with firestone might not be the best move, since 60 spelldmg and 1% direct damage increase aint the same, but well, ulduar got many staffs, so with such gear might be way more easy to balance things out and sort on wich proccs and triggered effects the weapon switch has its best value. About the specc thingie, this is worth doing only if you have 2/2 master conjuror and some sort of procc/triggered effect as backdraft is, wich can actually give some sort of significant change to your cast time and direct hit/crit. PS: i'm new to the forum  , and if this topic should be moved to another section plz say it there or contact me with a private messege. (hope it doesnt cause any trouble  )
Last edited by Nefritz; May 18, 2009 at 06:40 PM.. |
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May 18, 2009, 07:36 PM
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#177 (permalink) |
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Character Info
lilsteele 80 Human Warlock Terenas Euro PvE |
Re: Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs
switching weapons seems to be a funny idea... and simcraft can't do it!!! I plugged your spec into simcraft, without any optimizations, and it seems ok, some 300 dps below the 3.1 destro and 40/31 (with T8 gear). Could get a bit better by putting in the life tap glyph So, its not too surprising that you could do well with your spec. Although I wouldn't conisder a single fight as a proof that it is significantly better than anything else. I wonder how big the effect of changing weapons is. My feeling is that it itsn't too much, but well, thats just a feeling On the practical side, while you can be in a situation where you have two equal weapons, this will most likely not be the case. In particular there is always a best weapon in game (e.g. TTT pre 3.1) and switching it for a worse weapon will be a dps loss. think the topic is fine here. If you want to discuss the macro's in more detail, you might want to do it in the UI¯o section. |
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May 18, 2009, 08:06 PM
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#178 (permalink) | ||
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Re: Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs
Quote:
About the simcraft: i'm running with t7.5 still, and i'd need to work out my haste pretty much (actually to bring it to a certain rating that fits best somehow) However i think my gear and sockets atm bring me to a point where i must admit (sadly ) that i lack of crit. Would aim to a real 33% crit (1 out of 3 incinerates crits at least) wich would be more effective then something around 3% haste at this point (WTT haste for crit!...no rly, i do)Quote:
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May 18, 2009, 08:58 PM
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#179 (permalink) |
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Re: Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs
You can effectively trade haste for crit by switching your spec to say, 41/30. Not having backlash and gaining crit out of demo tactics. It's theoretically a better spec than your current one as well. @Lil, have you run any sims of 0/18/53 vs 0/13/58? I'm curious how far apart they are in simcraft. I know the EJ thread discounts 18/53 completely and I know why it does, but I still think 18/53 "may" have a place at the table. Here's why: 13/58 is top on EJ simcraft becuase it requires less life taps than any other spec, thus more time spent dpsing. Let's assume the 2% mana back portion of ISL in 13/58 is better for personal dps in an all out stand still fight. Let's also assume you and your raid get the replenishment effect from somewhere else. Seems reasonable. My fear is that there is enough moving during Uld fights that those saved lifetaps will go to waste. Right now on live as 41/30 the ratio of moving to lifetapping feels about right for most fights. I life tap when I have to move or refresh corruption and I rarely ever have to lifetap during my "burn" phases, which is perfect. If 13/58 will lifetap less then I'm afraid I'll be forced to move by fight mechanics and have nothing to do. Conflag and CoD will be priority of course, but CoD can't be counted on as a filler while moving and neither can conflag really. I can cast corruption as 13/58 but it's not even part of the regular rotation for 13/58 so you know it's not doing much. The tried and true fall back while moving is lifetap, but if 13/58 won't use those lifetaps and won't even have the lifetap glyph then I'm essentially wasting gcds. And nothing is worse than wasting gcds doing nothing. Here is where 18/53 "might" come in. I'm discounting 3/13/55 because with the amount of +hit on Ulduar gear and T8 tier gear there is just no way I'm getting down to 11% hit without severely gimping my gear. So I'm looking at 18/53 and thinking that it may actually perform better given the amount of moving I have to do in almost all Ulduar fights. The imp will do more damage and pets, especially the imp, have to move less during fights than players do. The other option is just using the lifetap glyph with 13/58 even though EJ says Immo glyph is better. At least I could get the buff from tapping while moving even if the mana gains went to waste. So, long story short, without making any claims, I'm wondering the differences between 13/58 and 18/53. If the difference in stand still dps is small enough 18/53 "may" in fact result in more real world damage. |
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