| World of Warcraft Discussion General Discussion about anything relating to World of Warcraft and the Warlock's place with in... |
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September 25, 2008, 11:40 AM
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#1 (permalink) | |
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Character Info
Cascade 80 Human Warlock Argent Dawn US PvE Guild: Silver Dawn Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 56/0/15 |
Our class role ??
So reading thru some random blue posts I come across this... MMO-Champion BlueTracker - So wait let me get this straight..... Quote:
So why are warlocks and mages around? If our job (assmuning its dps) can be done just as well as a Hybrid, which could also heal in emergencies, or easily switch, or support melee...why play a "pure" class? |
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September 25, 2008, 11:52 AM
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#2 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Debuff 80 Orc Warlock Sargeras US PvP Guild: Fenrir Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/13/58 |
Re: Our class role ??
That's a good point to bring up. I guess the only thing that I can suggest is that pure dps classes have the flexibility to do their dps in multiple ways. Yes an elemental shaman can also heal in a pinch but when he has to do dps (whether it be in raids or in pvp) he is pretty much tied to standing there firing off endless streams of lightning bolts. Warlocks, however, can spec for the high long-term dps spec (destro), the high burst spec (deep destro with the pvp stuff), high survivability (heavy demo), and high sustainability/instant cast spec (deep affliction). So while we may not have as much flexibility in changing roles as they do, we do have much more flexibility within our own role. /shrug. Just another way to look at it. |
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September 25, 2008, 12:14 PM
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#3 (permalink) |
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Re: Our class role ??
doesn't this further their idea of making you play with friends rather then actual class X blizzard in wrath seems to want you to bring 4 to 24 other people you respect trust and enjoy your wow time with knowing full well that a) they can pump out decent dps ( as this blue posts kinda alludes to ) b) bring some decent buffs along ( as previous blue post alludes to with buffs being spread to other class ) compared to The Burning Crusade which is "omg we're screwed! where's our spriest?!" |
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September 25, 2008, 12:22 PM
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#4 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Wudefliction 70 Undead Warlock Cenarion Circle US RP Guild: Rising Force Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 41/0/20 |
Re: Our class role ??
I believe mages and warlocks will still be riding the front of the DPS bus. In previous posts blues have said mages are supposed to be the king of DPS, and warlocks will be right there too. I think the post above is simply them saying that (in comparable gear) a shammies will be competitive, and could top a poorly played 'lock or mage. Clearly, there are some roles hybrids cannot compete in (i.e. AOE damage). |
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September 25, 2008, 12:39 PM
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#5 (permalink) |
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Character Info
AballahSonDi 80 Human Warlock Alexstraza US PvE Guild: StormpikeShocktroopers Profile: Talent Spec: 56/0/15 |
Re: Our class role ??
I have been talking about this on numerous threads and here is my base opinion. If I am putting together some type of instance/raid and I know that all DPS are equal why would I not bring toons that can do insane damage and bring all the utility. Okay lets assume the following we are going into Instance A: --Requires CC --A few of the pulls are very tough and could require extra heals --I also might need an OT for those pulls instead of OH. Well lets look at the classes that we just ruled out: Warlocks - Rogues The two pure DPS classes in my Opinion. So in this LFG I have a mage, shaman, pali, warlock, and a rogue. To myself - "Well we could bring the lock or the rogue but they can't really help us in these fights. Oh great there is a pali in there he can just OT when we need him to and at the same time he can drop around some minor heals otherwise oh and with he can DPS just as good as a warlock or rogue but still OT because he is a plate wearer. Or we could get the mage great CC DPS same as everyone else. Or we could get the Shaman he can DPS just like everyone else plus he can OH on those tougher pulls." This is the problem for me if you want to make all the classes "the same" just take out the classes and lets all just play one hybrid type toon we don't need anymore classes we just need everyone to be able to do the same things so everyone else quits QQing about this and that. This equal DPS thing is a load - the day that one of our Hybrid classes starts out doing a pure DPS class is the day I start really throwing a fit. I know everyone talks about the changes to buffs/debuffs this is not helpful at all to anyone. Essentially this is what is going on - the developers have decided that it should be okay for a hybrid with all there other utility to do the same DPS as a pure DPS class this in itself is silly. So fellow warlocks get ready to be left behind for classes that all do the same DPS and have all those other goodies that can help other players out. Furthermore maybe your guild will just make you go to a farming spec so you can farm all of there mats for there raids, I mean at least there you will be doing something that maybe the hybrids can't do as well. I am so happy to know that we are now going to be throw back for when the Hybrid classes aren't available. This entire idea is essentially WoW changing to communism so we can all get along..... /rant Last edited by AballahSon; September 25, 2008 at 12:42 PM.. |
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September 25, 2008, 01:12 PM
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#6 (permalink) | |
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Character Info
Vaell 80 Blood Elf Warlock Scarshield Legion Euro RP PvP Guild: The Final Contingency Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 0/41/30 |
Re: Our class role ??
Quote:
Look at it this way. How many other classes got pushed out of encounters in BC because they didn't offer enough to a raid? That had everything to do with class and nothing to do with ability or friendship, so it's not a new concept. Hopefully with wrath it will become an old concept and we can just play with people we like, providing the 3 basic roles are fulfilled. If a guild will only take hybrid classes to raids I'd join a more reasonable guild that want people there for their attitude and companionship over being a specific class. It's surely the answer to the old problem, not a new one. As for being left behind: I'm the GM of a modest guild of friends and as long as we have Tanking, Healing and DPS covered between us, I'm there. As are my pure class friends. |
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September 25, 2008, 01:46 PM
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#7 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Whistlepants 80 Human Warlock Quel' Dorei US PvE Guild: The Legends of Honor Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 00/41/30 |
Re: Our class role ??
***rant alert*** I have been hunting for a blue post on the WoW official forums that I had read awhile back but have been unable to find it. It taked about Wrath and the upcoming patch and said that one of the goals was to make the "nonessential" classes more versatile. That's ridiculous. You can't please all of the people all the time. If you wanna do massive damage be a lcok or if you wanna do massive heals be a priest and if you wanna tank the whole world be a warrior. Otherwise give my warlock AoE healing spells and pally buffs. Don't take away from me by giving everyone else the ability to do wat I do. If they can't figure out that a lock is not a healer when they roll the toon make a new one. Shadow priests are bad enough as it is not too mention shaman and druids. I mean for goodness sake I have fought druids in BGs that were immune to my fear tanked me with bear form and healed themselves. It's freaking ridiculous!  ***end rant*** |
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September 25, 2008, 01:52 PM
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#8 (permalink) |
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Character Info
AballahSonDi 80 Human Warlock Alexstraza US PvE Guild: StormpikeShocktroopers Profile: Talent Spec: 56/0/15 |
Re: Our class role ??
@Vaell I agree with what you are saying completely. I guess I am taking a negative approach to a lot of things. I guess this is the way that I was looking at things overall. Due to someone getting deployed in our guild(GM) I have taken over the roll as raid leader to an extent. Our guild has finally got enough people able and willing to start doing some raids past Karazhan and we are really excited. Unlike many others who have quit raiding and are taking it easy for a month and a half here we are making the final push trying to get as far in content as we can. We are doing this for multiple reasons which I won't go into here. With the background from above you can see that we are pushing hard and taking our best players/toons to each raid in order to see some real progression. What worries me in Wrath of the Lich King is if I am going to be selective about taking the best possible team do I leave my lock parked in the shed and roll a hybrid class because in my mind if they can do the same DPS and provide more utility than by going into the raid with my current toon would be less than taking the best. I am really just trying to wrap my mind around what the developers are trying to do and why they feel it is neccessary to make all classes equal in damage. If that is the attitude than lets make all classes equal in everything, ie a warlock tank, healer, and DPS and do the same with all classes that way the difference in toon becomes purely cosmetic(which I think is part of what they are trying to do) and has no difference other than human vs draenei vs BE etc. I really just wish that there was something being done to brush past all this everyone equal stuff. When I started playing WoW I felt like I had found a game that I could apply my unique personality and get a unique toon/playstyle this has been accomplished to an extent, of course, now all of it will change. For example - I liked the difference in gear choices and speccing into shadow or frost or fire by gear. Now we just all wear the same stuff so joy the developers don't have to spend as much time implementing more pieces of gear they just dump one in that works for all X classes. I get it they are trying to cut down on Server Maintenance and Development costs which is commendable except for a company that continually boasts about there high numbers of users which directly leads to more profits. Another thing that has been flat aggravating me is the fact that our blue poster isn't even playing a warlock he plays a druid.....WTH? Makes one wonder if they even want the warlock class in the game. Okay overall I want to apologize to all for my endless ranting about this, I guess I am just so disapointed I don't really know how else to vent it out. I have met some great friends through WoW so I feel like quitting the game I would lose touch with them so now I feel just stuck with a game that once was great and is ever fading into mediocrity. Oh well, we all know I will continue to play I guess I just need to buck up or shut up. I guess I should start a new thread to see what classes other warlocks have liked as a second class. |
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September 25, 2008, 02:07 PM
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#9 (permalink) | |
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Character Info
Whistlepants 80 Human Warlock Quel' Dorei US PvE Guild: The Legends of Honor Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Spec: 00/41/30 |
Re: Our class role ??
Quote:
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September 25, 2008, 02:19 PM
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#10 (permalink) |
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Re: Our class role ??
I see both sides. While taking 25 hybrids seems like the way to go... it won't be worth it. Basically due to the theory of diminishing returns. You don't need many, or any hybrids, and while they bring benifits, having 15 off healing DPS won't help more than 1. By simularly having buffs so stacked, you only *need* 4 or 5 different classes. Every class still brings little things, so variety doesn't hurt, but you end up taking the players who make time and effort, rather than stacking less skilled, less chilled and less fun players for the cumulative effect of every class. In a 25 man situation, you have 7 healers, 4 tanks and 14 DPS, for example, provided you have maybe 1 spare off healer among the DPS and one among the tanks you have all you'll; ever need, really. After that you just take whoever logged on, buffed and ready, first, or who will pay attention. Or whatever. Every class has a few unique tricks, which can't be replicated, albeit small ones. My only concern is that our DPS won't justify the incoming heals any more. That said hopefully "same ballpark" means "Locks will end up with a tiny edge which compensates for their bigger demands" however even then... we do provide healthstones and the more locks the better (well up to 3, mages stack up 1 unlss many sheeps helps) and so hopefully people will not mind so much... |
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