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Old April 22, 2009, 10:16 PM   #1 (permalink)

Character Info
Ardvicio
80 Blood Elf Warlock
Silverwing Hold PvP
Guild: Dreamchaser
Profile: Blizzard Armory
If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

My Philosophy:
- Warlocks are different from mages.
- Pets need to play a bigger role in utility (Felhunter is fine though)
- More decision making, more cooldowns
- PVP viable specs (note the 's' in 'specs')
- Slightly discourage hybrid specs
- Fix useless spells and talents
- Fix fear

My wishlist is written in patch notes format.

General:
Facing requirement removed for targets within 5 yard radius.

Pets can now be ordered exactly where to go. Replaces ‘Stay’ on the pet action bar. Places a targeted area to order your pet to go and stay there.

Warlocks:

General:


Soulshards can now be stacked up to 40 - in one slot.
PVP Gear sets now have approx. 50% bonus armor

Soul Link has been made trainable! Visit your trainer to learn this baseline spell!


Pets:

Pets inherit 100% of master’s resilience and spell penetration.

Summon spells are now 6 second baseline.
We want disposable pets, not dead pet = dead warlock

Imp has a new ability replacing Fire Shield
Fel Blast
Instant cast. Cooldown 60 secs.
Instantly unleashes Fel Bolt, dealing (around 100% more damage than regular Imp firebolt) fire damage and Phase Shifting the target for 4 seconds, reducing all damage done by 50%.

Voidwalker has a new ability replacing Torment
Void Blast
Instant cast. Cooldown 60 secs.
Blasts the target, doing (minor) damage and knocking it back 5 yards at 50% speed.

Felguard has a new ability:
Disarm: Cooldown 60 secs
Disarms the target, forcing it to drop its weapons for 5 seconds.

Succubus has a new ability replacing Soothing Kiss:
Swifthoof
Channeled. Cooldown 60 secs
Channels dark magic to the warlock, increasing movement speed by 80% for 3 seconds. Any damage taken by the Succubus halts the effect.
I always wanted warlocky rocket boots


Affliction:

Curse of Exhaustion and Curse of Tongues have been combined.

Curse of Exhaustion (talent) has been removed.

Fear has been reworked:
Fear
20 yard range. Instant cast.
Fears your target, causing it to run from you in fear for 20 seconds. Fear breaks when target loses 20% of max health. (PVP duration: 6 sec max, or 8 sec if 2/2 Malediction)
Hopefully will not be able to fearlock people. With DR it would be 6-3-1.5 or 8-4-2 sec fears.

Malediction has been reduced to 2 ranks:
Increases the periodic critical strike chance of your Corruption and Unstable Affliction spells by 10%, and increases the max duration of fear by 2 seconds. No longer increases spell damage.
Increased fear duration because affliction needs time to do damage

Improved Felhunter has been removed.
Don't tell me this talent is useful

Haunt is now instant cast and has its cooldown increased to 10 secs.
I'm sure it won't become Arcane Barrage

Suppression has been removed.
Incorporated into cataclysm

Grim Reach has been removed.
Incorporated into Demo Reach

Shadow Embrace has been redesigned: (3 ranks)
Your Curse of Agony, Curse of Doom, Curse of Weakness have a 100% chance to increase spell damage taken by the target by 13%. Your Shadowbolt and Haunt spells also decreases healing received by the target by 30%.
CoE still provides spell penetration.

Shadow Mastery no longer requires one point in Siphon Life.

Dark Pact has been replaced by Shatter Curse.

Shatter Curse: Cooldown 2 mins. Instantly consumes your curse effect on the target and:
Agony: Your enemy immobilizes in pain, rooting it in place for 4 seconds.
Exhaustion: Forces your enemy to assist your demon by chanting (channeling) in demonic for 3 seconds, increasing the damage dealt by your demon by 100%, lasts 6 seconds.
Elements: Releases the power of the banished elementals, restricting the damage output of your enemy by 50%, lasts 5 secs.
Weakness: Further weakens your enemy’s mind, inflicting their next special attack or damaging spell to themselves. This cannot be a critical strike.
Doom: Instantly deals damage equal to 150% of your Curse of Doom effect.
Remember Doom can only affect PVE targets

Drain soul now ticks every second. DPS unchanged. Each tick has a 20% chance to generate a soul shard. (e.g: 3000 per tick per 3 sec -> 1000 per tick per sec)
I don't want to wait 3 secs for DS to tick.

Howl of terror is now a terror effect - shares DR with deathcoil. Max duration reduced to 5 seconds.
Would this be OP? I doubt it.

Contagion now increases damage of Corruption, Curse of Agony and Seed of Corruption by 10%, up from 5%
Compensation for losing Shadow Embrace

Everlasting Affliction now increases spell damage coefficient of Corruption and UA by 10%, up from 5%.
Same as above

Demonology:

Demonic Circle: Teleport and Demonic Circle: Summon has been removed.
I never liked Demoport. Lore doesn't fit, and we are not slippery mages.

New talent in Tier 1: (2 ranks)
Demonic Reach: Increase the effect range of all spells by 20%. (max rank)

Mana Feed now restores mana to your demon by 50% of the mana you gain from Lifetap and Drain Mana, down from 100%

Demonic Empowerment now uses your demon’s global cooldown and mana.

Demon Armor has been reworked:
Increases armor and health of the caster equal to 120% of stamina, and increases all healing received by 20%.
Locks have around 1400 stam. Demonic Aegis increases the bonus to 156%

Demonic Brutality, Imp Succubus and Imp Imp have been combined. (Tier 2)
We only use one pet anytime anyway.

Decimation has been removed.

Metamorphosis: Cooldown reduced to 2 mins.

Fel Domination has its cooldown reduced to 5 minutes baseline for 4 sec cast time reduction.

Master Summoner now reduces cast times by 1 sec per rank.

Fel stamina now increases stamina by 15%, up from 10%

Demonic Sacrifice: A revised baseline spell for warlocks
Requires: Soulshard
Cooldown: 2 minutes
Banishes your demon for 8 seconds, and decreasing all damage you take and deal by 80%, lasts 8 seconds.

Nemesis has been reworked: Every time your pet strikes an enemy you gain the Nemesis effect, decreasing the cast time of Soul Fire by 10%, stacks up to 6 times. Casting Soul Fire resets the effect. Casting Soul Fire under this effect does not consume a soulshard.
Less clunky than Deciweave

Soulshatter: Also clears all stuns and movement impairing effects, cooldown reduced to 3 minutes.
Coz it's meant to shatter.


Destruction:

Destructive Reach has been removed.

Emberstorm: Fire damage increase reduced to 10%

Shadow and Flame: Now affects Soul Fire and Shadowflame instead of Shadowbolt, bonus damage effect gained decreased to 15%, down from 20%.
Who uses SB in deep destro?

Immolate’s DoT component has been changed to be affected by 100% of spell power, down from 120%

Conflagrate reverted: This spell consumes the Immolate/shadowflame effect on your target and applies immolate’s DoT damage instantly.
With the nerf to Immolate's scaling, this one's damage will be fine. Double dip on resil targets, damage will be even finer.

Aftermath has been redesigned: 2/2
Your spell critical strikes heal you for 30% of the damage done over 8 secs.

Imp Searing Pain has been reworked:
Your Searing Pain spell has a 100% chance to daze the target for 5 seconds but cooldown has been increased to 10 seconds.

Hellfire has been redesigned:
Hellfire
20% Base Health and 20% Base Mana
2 Sec Cast. 90 Sec Cooldown.
Raises flames from the ground on a 5-yard radius targeted area, trapping enemies within and causing 570 fire damage over 5 seconds. No damage can travel through hellfire.
Idea came from the shower.

Shadowburn has been renamed and revised: Soulburn, now causing fire damage.

Soulburn: (no longer requires a reagent)
Instantly blasts the target’s soul for 674 to 752 fire damage. Deals 20% more damage and creates a soulshard when Soulburn strikes an enemy below 35% health.
Destro's real PVP execute

Soul Leech is now reduced to two ranks for full effect.

Molten Skin has been removed.

Cataclysm now increases hit chance for all spells by 3% at max rank in addition to its old effect.
Only raiding 'locks need 3% I believe, and all raiding locks put points into destro.

Nether Protection: After being hit with a spell or physical attack, you have a 30% chance to gain Nether Protection, reducing all physical damage or damage of that spell school by 40% for 8 secs. 8 sec cooldown.
We need help against melee, and less against casters.

Pyroclasm: also grants a 100% chance to disorient your enemy for 3 secs after using Conflagrate.
Mini escape for Destro. Damage will break it.

Fire and Brimstone: Increases damage of Immolate by 15% of spell power, and your Chaos Bolt and Conflagrate spells have a 10% chance to cause your next Soul Fire to be instant cast after striking a target affected by your Curse of Doom.
Remember Curse of Doom can only be casted on players.


Glyphs:

Glyph of Shadowbolt: Removed.
Glyph of Demonic Circle: Removed.
Glyph of Healthstone has been reworked: After consuming a healthstone, all damage taken is decreased by 30%, lasts 5 seconds.
I think this is better than copying talent points.

Glyph of Fel Fire: Embeds all your fire spells with Fel energy.

Glyph of Unstable Affliction: Every time your Unstable Affliction effects deal damage, you have a 10% chance to instantly destroy 5 energy, rage, runic power or 4% of mana from your enemy.

Glyph of Fel Synergy: Your pet also heals you for 15% of damage done.

Last edited by Akasha; April 26, 2009 at 01:29 AM.. Reason: Copied over info from revised post.
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Old April 23, 2009, 11:42 AM   #2 (permalink)

Character Info
Crimsonhead
90 Undead Warlock
Shadowmoon US PvP
Guild: Authority
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Talent Tree: Destruction
Re: If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

Wow this is an awesome list, to one day see such changes would be a huge leap for locks, here are the pros that I really like and the cons (things that should get nerfed if this were to ever happen, or things that are little more than op or things that warlocks in general I don't think would agree with)

Liked


Shadow and Flame: Now affects Soul Fire instead of Shadowbolt

I Agree, when was the last time i casted that unless it was instant proc or during backlash?

2. Shatter Curse: Cooldown 2 mins. Instantly consumes your curse effect on the target and depending on the curse:
- Agony: Your enemy immobilizes in pain, rooting it in place for 5 seconds.
- Tongues: Forces your enemy to assist your demon by chanting (channeling) in demonic for 3 seconds, increasing the damage dealt by your demon by 100%, lasts 5 seconds.
- Weakness: Further weakens your enemy’s mind, inflicting their next special attack or damaging spell to themselves, lasts 5 seconds.
- Exhaustion: Drains 30 of your enemy’s energy, rage or runic power instantly
- Doom: Instantly deals damage equal to 200% of your Curse of Doom effect.


This is a great idea and I like where your going with this, if we have a "consume and deal damage" on the destro side, why not afflic? (I assume this would be in the affliction tree)

3. Conflagrate altered: This spell consumes the Immolate/shadowflame effect on your target and applies 75% total immolate’s DoT damage instantly. Also reduces all damage caused by 30% for 8 seconds. (this effect is immune to bosses)

Great Idea, has a lot of pvp viability (much more than now), would be real cool to see.

Pyroclasm reworked: (Requires one point in Conflagrate) When you critically strike with Conflagrate, your next Soul Fire will be instant cast.

Like you said, pve viability as well as pvp usable.

5. Shadowburn has been renamed: Soulburn.

Soulburn: (no longer requires a reagent)
Instantly blasts the target’s soul for 775 to 865 shadow damage. Deals 30% more damage to enemies below 35% health. If the target dies within 5 secs of Soulburn, the caster gains a soul shard.


Love it, No shard and the glyph implemented, great stuff!

6. Fire and Brimstone: Increases damage of Immolate by 15% of spell power, and increases damage of Chaos Bolt and Conflagrate if immolate is on the target.

F&B is broken right mow, this is the fix that could really boost it.

7. Howl of terror is now a terror effect - shares DR with deathcoil. Max duration reduced to 5 seconds.


Nice, annoying how Fear is a Fear effect (duh) as is howl of terror. Imo Terror = Horror more than Fear, so good call.

Demonic Sacrifice: A revised baseline spell for warlocks
Requires: Soulshard
Cooldown: 2 minutes
Banishes your demon for 10 seconds, and decreasing all damage you take and deal by 80%, lasts 10 seconds.


I Like this one, Lot of classes have an ability similar or close to this, would be nice.


Disliked or OP

1. Demon Armor: (max rank)
Increases armor and health of the caster equal to 100% of stamina, and increases all healing received by 20%.

Fel Armor: Amount of flat spell power granted is decreased by 50% for all ranks. Spirit scaling is unaffected.


The Demon armor buff is a little, no a lot over the top. 100% stam? thats like 13 or 14k for some locks. And you say you don't want warlocks dependent on their armor but this says otherwise. As for fel armor, its the bread and butter for those leveling locks once they get it, it would hurt them a lot.

2. Immolate’s DoT component has been changed to be affected by 100% of spell power, down from 120%

I think that Immo's damage is fine as it is seeing that conflag got nerfed to 75%.

3. New spell: Soul Empowerment
Requires: Soulshard
Consumes a soulshard to empower the caster, increasing haste by 20% for 10 seconds. Cooldown 2 minutes.


We have spellstones that are buffed out the wazoo, maybe a buff to fire stone, but this seems a little useless.

4. Drain soul now ticks every second. DPS unchanged. Each tick has a 20% chance to generate a soul shard.

It would be impossible for DPS to be unchanged for afflic locks in that last 25% phase, dps would be out the roof seeing as of now ticks are for around 10k+ with all dots.

5. UA is now instant cast, and has its duration increased to 18 seconds.

Not only would priests scream and qq, this is just way too overpowered. Increase the duration AND Make it instant? one or the other imo, not both.

Other Comments

1. Dark Pact has been reworked:
15% Base mana
1 min cooldown
Detonates all shadow DoT effects, consuming them and dealing 50% of remaining damage instantly. Also deals 500 (does not scale) damage to caster for each shadow DoT consumed. (This damage does not gain DoT damage increase bonuses)


Explain this in more detail, I don't really know what your trying to do with this. It deals damage to us? or to our target?

2. Demonic Circle: Teleport can now be used while stunned but does not remove stuns.

Why? whats the point teleporting while stunned if we cant remove it? It could work but maybe a little tweaking

Overall, Great list, you have some really cool ideas and can go many places with a lot of them. I have a few additions

Drain Mana (Max Rank)

Drain Mana is no longer a channeled spell but a Debuff, transferring 1% of Mana to the warlock every 3 seconds for 45 Seconds. New Name "Mana Tap"

Improved Life Tap

Life tap now has a chance (1%/3%/5%) to grant you the amount of mana you gain from the Life Tap, without consuming any health. Previous talent benefits reduced to 10% (down from 20%)

Improved Fear (Reworked)

If your fear target resists or is immune to your fear, you have a chance (1%, 3%. 5%) to make your next fear instant cast, and then immobilize your target for 3 seconds making them incapacitated. New Name "Shadow of a Doubt"

This is all I got, hope you enjoy my touch ups/comments
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Old April 23, 2009, 11:51 AM   #3 (permalink)

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Facemurder
80 Gnome Warlock
Ajzol-Nerub US PvE
Guild: Clan Battlehammer
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Re: If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

I liked some of that stuff..

most of it would just have all the other classes screaming about OPness and nerfing.. which I'd have to agree with.
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Old April 23, 2009, 12:17 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Status: <Demon Trainer>

Character Info
Pernicious
80 Blood Elf Warlock
Dark Iron US PvP
Guild: Allmacht
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Re: If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

The Demon Armor is actually very Under Powered in your example. Increasing my Armor by 100% of my stam will actually drop it by a good amount. The current spell grants me 2100 armor, I only have 858 Stamina. You can see the difference.

I think you might have meant Increases armor by 100% of your Health, which is different. In that case I would stand to gain about 14k armor which is definitely OP. Perhaps it should read, Increases your total Armor by 50% your total Health. As I think a 7k gain is reasonable given the loss of spell power and healing that Fel Armor grants.


I like a lot of your other ideas. the change to Demonic Sacrifice is interesting. I would almost suggest making it: "Your pet takes 100% of damage dealt to you over the next 10 seconds."

That way it is more of a sacrifice to the pet with the possibility that it actually dies. Giving us a 10 second (or less if the pet dies) immunity at the expense of our pet might balance out.
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Old April 23, 2009, 12:33 PM   #5 (permalink)

Character Info
Ardvicio
80 Blood Elf Warlock
Silverwing Hold PvP
Guild: Dreamchaser
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Re: If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

Thanks for reading it.

Ok, let me explain a little bit.

iinferno:
Lock have ~1400 stam, which means a 1400 health and armor increase.
Your idea on Imp Life Tap is RNG, which might break or make a game.... if you know what I mean.

Pernicious:
I'm not too sure if the armors are underpowered.
I have tried to reduce the impact on the 'nerf' by granting baseline damage reduction and talent compensation.
e.g.: PVP gear has more armor. This will probably grant 3% physical damage reduction, might not be enough, but numbers are easily changed.

Oh, and Demonic Sac, I actually have thought about your suggestion, but given the damage all classes deal, wouldn't the pet die in 5 seconds, negating the benefits of soul link, and among other stuff?


Dark Pact:
Meant to be affliction's burst on demand. Consumes available DoTs to generate burst damage but also inflicting damage on the caster (but affliction has many self-healing capabilities anyway, but that can be adjusted)

Demonic Circle:
Well, I actually doubt my idea too, but something has to be done about Demoport. I really want to get rid of the spell though.

Shatter Curse of Doom:
Doom can only affect PVE targets anyway.

Soul Empowerment:
Yeah, I agree, on-demand haste is boring. (No, that's not sarcasm)


I'm still at school, so I'll look into alterations when I get back.

Last edited by fabeschan; April 23, 2009 at 11:30 PM..
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Old April 23, 2009, 01:21 PM   #6 (permalink)

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Crimsonhead
90 Undead Warlock
Shadowmoon US PvP
Guild: Authority
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Talent Tree: Destruction
Re: If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

i see you make constructive use of your school time

(and no, thats not sarcastic)

oh ya about imp. life tap, i was thinkin making it 10%/20%/30%, and give it a 15-20 sec CD, that way it wont be op, but it would help out
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Last edited by iinferno21; April 23, 2009 at 01:24 PM..
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Old April 23, 2009, 03:05 PM   #7 (permalink)

Character Info
Hike
80 Undead Warlock
Blackwing Lair US PvP
Guild: Occam's Raiders
Re: If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

well... i will say grats on compiling such a thorough list... but i definitely won't be as thorough in my response lol. i'll just make a few comments

i like the concept of being able to "consume" a curse for an additional effect. i think the CoD effect would give us WAY too much burst damage... i know for my current setup that would be like 13k+ damage... i can't imagine if this were combined with Conflagerate what that would accomplish

tier 3 master conjurer with no other changes would be OP

removing suppression is a bad idea... other classes have talents to increase their chance to hit & so should we...

making UA insta-cast is also a bad idea. the post 3.1 affliction rotations are easy enough as it is...

some really good ideas in there though overall. i hope someone takes notice
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Old April 23, 2009, 06:14 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Status: <Demon Trainer>

Character Info
Pernicious
80 Blood Elf Warlock
Dark Iron US PvP
Guild: Allmacht
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Re: If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

Quote:
Originally Posted by fabeschan View Post
Pernicious:
I'm not too sure if the armors are underpowered.
I have tried to reduce the impact on the 'nerf' by granting baseline damage reduction and talent compensation.
e.g.: PVP gear has more armor. This will probably grant 3% physical damage reduction, might not be enough, but numbers are easily changed.

Oh, and Demonic Sac, I actually have thought about your suggestion, but given the damage all classes deal, wouldn't the pet die in 5 seconds, negating the benefits of soul link, and among other stuff?
It seemed as if you were reducing the effectiveness to Fel Armor so that you could improve Demon Armor to reach a more satisfactory balance that would make more of a harder choice when applying your Armor Spell. However, the loss of 1k armor from Demon Armor seemed to negate that, so I merely assumed you meant to increase it by Health rather than stamina. In the case of using Health instead, it seemed as if the Demon Armor would then become too great. I haven't looked too closely at all the changes you've outlined, but if you've increased damage reduction through other abilities then nerfing Demon Armor isn't so bad.

As far as my Demonic Sacrifice comment. I don't really think the pet would die in 5 seconds, It all depends on how or when you use the spell. It could be key in PvP situations in that it allows you to survive just a pinch longer so that you could get a Fear off or that one last burst to kill your opponent. The downside is that you risk loosing your pet. It's a heavy risk, but one well placed in a class that constantly risks life for power. Additionally, this spell falls in the Demonology Tree where you can pick up Fel Domination to quickly regain your pet. That might help offset your higher risk of loosing your pet in the first place.

The spell adds some very interesting decision making for the player that has real risks and heavy payoffs if you succeed. Something I personally enjoy.
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Old April 23, 2009, 06:52 PM   #9 (permalink)

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Ihrumo
80 Blood Elf Warlock
Staghelm US PvE
Guild: Exiled
Profile: Blizzard Armory
Re: If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

Pyroclasm reworked: (Requires one point in Conflagrate) When you critically strike with Conflagrate, your next Soul Fire will be instant cast.
This will provide PVE damage increase, and affects PVP only a little.


IMO, this would be incredibly OP in PVP. 7k crit with conflag and then a large Soulfire Crit following it up?

Conflagrate altered: This spell consumes the Immolate/shadowflame effect on your target and applies 75% total immolate’s DoT damage instantly. Also reduces all damage caused by 30% for 8 seconds. (this effect is immune to bosses)


I'm assuming this means that the player/mob hit with conflag is the one doing 30% less damage for 8 seconds? With the glyph allowing immolate to remain up and Conflag cooldown being 10 seconds, wouldn't this be in affect majority of the time? Also seems a little OP, especially with the random Soulfires you throw at them instantly.

Or maybe I'm reading this all wrong, but that is my take on those two things.
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Old April 23, 2009, 07:07 PM   #10 (permalink)

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Dunwich
80 Undead Warlock
Drenden US PvE
Guild: Kitten Soup
Re: If I Were to Fix Warlocks... (Big List)

I would make one major change to Warlocks;

The Succubus should be a caster. Give her little shadow bolts and she's pretty much fixed.
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