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May 10, 2009, 05:09 PM
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#1 (permalink) |
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Loot system problems
hello guys, our guild has some problems with the loot system. We are a growing guild atm and some of the core people want to use dkp but others not, its like 50/50. The core people say its more fair if we use dkp. The problem is that we dont wanna end up in that people are leaving the guild because we gonna use dkp or not.. So im looking for a good solutions, so that people that are realy putting effort in raiding getting rewarded and having their loot.. So spare me your thoughts about it, or if you had the same thing going on in your guild how did you managed it.. |
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May 10, 2009, 05:19 PM
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#2 (permalink) |
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Re: Loot system problems
I think it depends on what kinda guild you want. Hardcore Raid guilds use DKP. We are a family raid guild (silverfel) blackhand. We progress at a nice rate. Our loot rules in a nutshell: 1 need (main spec) 1 greed (off spec) You can roll need as many times as you want but if someone rolls against you that hasn't used their need they get the loot. Trash purples and items like the quest starter from sapph are opens rolls and doesnt count against your need. |
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May 10, 2009, 06:07 PM
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#3 (permalink) |
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Re: Loot system problems
without knowing anything about your guild, i would guess that the people opposed to dkp probably also have less time to play the game and don't want to fall behind in earning dkp, and they probably also know that after a few weeks the guys that can show up for every raid are going to have the points to beat them on anything they want. that is one of the problems of dkp, but the casual's sense of entitlement also unfairly taxes the people that can put more time in. you could always try loot council, but that has problems too. the guild i am in uses something called epgp, with a built in 10% decay for all members (in the raid or not) at the start of each raid night, and it seems to work out ok. you could also look into suicide kings, but you would probably need to build in a policy for adjusting people's position if they miss some raid nights. you really don't want to be giving some BiS item to a guy who happens to still be up on the SK list even though he hasn't raided in two weeks. if you decide to go with DKP i would recommend zero sum and trying to work in some type of decay to discourage hoarding. also make sure the class leads (if you have any) are watching out to make sure people are bidding on upgrades instead of hoarding for a certain item. no matter what system you use, you are probably going to have to deal with QQ from the people opposed to any system (except /roll). No matter what they say or type, they are really saying "i want to get the same chance on loot as other people that are able to put more time into this game than I can, even though I made the personal choice to put family, work, etc... ahead of showing up for raids". Sorry, but that is the long and short of it and you shouldn't reward them. They will still get loot, and they will get it faster than trade pugging, but the guys with no life/GF who are able to show up for every raid will (and should be) getting the loot first. Last edited by geryon; May 10, 2009 at 07:29 PM.. Reason: ergp should have read epgp |
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May 10, 2009, 06:21 PM
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#4 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Verdthandi 85 Human Priest Medivh US PvE Guild: Storm Profile: Blizzard Armory Talent Tree: Affliction |
Re: Loot system problems
I've used SKG (suicide kings something-or-other) in the past, and it's pretty good. Basically, you all "bid" your place in the list (determined by roll or whatever), and whoever has the highest number wins... but they suicide to the very bottom of the list. If you miss a raid, your place in the list gets skipped over as people move up after suicides, but you don't lose it--ie, if you're number 2 on the list, and your guild downs Sarth+3D without you, and number 1 suicides for the drake, you are still number 2.
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DoTs are like STDs, just because the person that gave them to you dies, doesn't mean you are cured. -Keelon of Frostmane |
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May 10, 2009, 06:25 PM
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#5 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Kelstor 70 Undead Warlock Korialstrasz US PvE Guild: Juggalo Raiders Profile: Blizzard Armory |
Re: Loot system problems
Our guild uses some point system; but if you have more than one toon...the points count for both your toons. Your points can build up. If you use your point you have to make sure you realize it counts against "YOU" and not your toons. Last edited by Kelstor; May 10, 2009 at 06:27 PM.. |
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May 10, 2009, 06:27 PM
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#6 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Burnslikehel 80 Human Warlock Akama US PvP Guild: Revolution Profile: Blizzard Armory |
Re: Loot system problems
My guild so far 8 bosses into uldaur. My guild master for the past year or so decides who gets loot based upon attendance. Tanks and healers always has first dibs and so far it has worked out pretty well. We do get from time to time someone getting upset about loot but thats something we live with. We do have a core of older members and we understand its about beating all the bosses and to boost everyones dps, tanking, healing stats. I pass on loot when I know the other lock needs it more than I do. So I guess it all depends. Best of luck with the system you choose. |
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May 10, 2009, 06:35 PM
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#7 (permalink) |
Status: Member
Character Info
Oliselia 80 Blood Elf Death Knight Cho'gall US PvP Guild: BLEED Profile: Blizzard Armory |
Re: Loot system problems
Why not give EPGP a shot? helps with reducing DKP hording / bidding wars and other less desirable DKP issues. I have been using EPGP for loot distribution as well as awarding / penalizing guild members for nearly a year now.
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May 10, 2009, 08:01 PM
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#8 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Volki 85 Undead Warlock winterhoof US PvE Guild: Unter dem Boden Talent Tree: Destruction |
Re: Loot system problems
Have been in guilds that use all systems but suicide kings, dont really understand that ones effectiveness but will say the on ei like the best so far is EP/GP, works very well having both hardcore and casual raiders in your guild. |
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May 10, 2009, 09:44 PM
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#9 (permalink) |
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Re: Loot system problems
All I will say is whatever system you do choose make sure you stick to it. There is nothing worse then changing system on the fly and one of your members get's bit in the butt by it. In my raiding guild in BC we used God Loot. You could roll on whatever you wanted but in the end the raid leader decided who the loot went to based on your performance that night. Say something you wanted dropped and you rolled the highest but you have been screwing up all night by not listening and you have wiped the raid more then one time and you have missed the last two raids, why should you be rewarded for that? However the guy who rolled second highest has not messed up once tonight is on the top of the dps charts and has not missed one raid. He gets the loot. It might not seem fair on paper but it worked out really well for us. All my raid leader and us officers wanted was for everyone was to shut and listen so that we don't wipe. If you can't do that and you cause a wipe more then once you don't get loot. Now the next time we go in there you can bet the person who was not paying attention is going to be this time. Now this system worked out pretty well like I said, except for one night. I had been running Kara for weeks. The only blue I had left was my weapon. I was promised the dagger from prince when he finally dropped it. On the night that he did we had a dps leave half way through and we brought in a pug to fill the spot. Well we get to prince and he finally drops my dagger I was freaking out. I roll even though I know I am going to get it because it has been promised to me for weeks but the pug boomkin rolls higher then me and the raid leader gives it to him. I was pissed to say the least. To add slat to the wound I found out later that he could not afford the enchant for it so he didn't use it for a few weeks after he got it. I have since been in 3 or 4 guilds with him and we are pretty good friends and we joke about it now but on that night I want to pluck all of his stupid boomkin feathers out and shadow blot him in the face. So whatever you do stick with the system so that someone doesn't get screwed over. Sorry for the wall of text. |
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May 10, 2009, 10:20 PM
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#10 (permalink) |
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Re: Loot system problems
As others have said, You have to reward the preople that put in the effort and DKP does this. What you need to do is convince those that cant raid as often that they will in fact get loot because of 2 things. 1, Those with high DKP will spend it 2, Once they have loot it starts to get realy cheep. I think the First time Sarth droped his trinket someone in our guild payed over 200 dkp for it, by the time it had droped a couple of time it was goen for minimum, 10! I have seen things go for huge DKP one week and get DEed the next. You have to press home that its a longer term thing and not to freek out about not having enough DKP to get it this week. It will drop again and it will end up going cheeeeeepppppp!!!! Having said that I know what its like to get people to think beyond this raid right here now. Almost imposible, lol. |
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