Squeezing dps out of affliction

[Kusasi]

Hey everyone, I must say I'm slightly apprehensive about posting another topic asking a question that's most definitely been seen. I believe all posts are moderated before being published, so if you're reading this, I guess it's ok. :P

In my guild we are gathering materials for SSC resistance gear and in the meantime we're working on Void Reaver and we hope to have down this coming Wednesday which will be our 3rd proper visit.

I've done a lot of reading about specs, what is viable for T4/T5 and T6 etc but opinions are SO divided that I'm coming to the conclusion that almost any spec, so long as it goes deep into one tree (bar maybe Demonology because you probably need the resistance bonuses from 2x T5 and trinket) will perform well. I understand the opinion that Affliction is best for T4, as Suppression helps to cap a lack of hit on gear, and Demonology is apparently best for T5, due to Solarian trinket and 2x T5 set bonus, and then Destro for T6 as gear comes with enough spell hit and crit (as far as I'm aware). It would make sense that Blizzard would tend gear towards certain talent trees to encourage you to experience all play styles available right? Particularly with warlocks as damage is all we do, we don't have the versatility of shamans, druids or pallies, but that's the idea of the class.

But at the same time it would seem harsh to force only one spec to be viable for each set of gear. What if you really enjoyed playing Felguard raiding spec and wanted to continue into BT/HJ/SP for instance? I really want to try that spec as it sounds like loads of fun.

Currently my guild can confidently do Gruul and Kara, we downed Jan'alai and Halazzi for the first time in one run last week which I was proud to be a part of. We're having another run tonight so hopefully we can get all four down again, most definitely not within the timer though. Maggy we have done too but not always so smoothly.

I'm currently a DP/Ruin build, which I enjoy very much, aggro can sometimes be a problem but if I watch myself I can handle it ok. I tried a UA build but aggro became such a problem that I didn't enjoy it. Mana was a bit of an issue too. Perhaps I didn't give the build enough time to show itself. On the dps charts in a 25 man I'll usually be anywhere from 6-9th on the list overall, and always 2nd in the warlock charts, assuming the best lock we have, who is 0/21/40, is there too.

She has almost identical gear to me, yet will perform up to about 1200dps compared to my 850-900dps in boss fights. So my belief that affliction is best for T4 level is somewhat thwarted by this. She is a very good player and knows what she is doing. I like to think that I am too. I always keep my dots up and renew them individually and spam SB's after. And I can manage my aggro well.

I usually go:

Siphon Life (sometimes)
Curse of Agony (amplified where possible)
Corruption
Immolate
SB

I use my Icon of Silver Crescent whenever available too and like I said, renew each dot as it expires. I'd like to think I'm squeezing as much dps out as I can. But destruction is simply outdoing me. I'm not frustrated by it, just intrigued. I do enjoy my spec very much. But is there something I'm doing wrong? If I was to go destruction I reckon my aggro would be pretty difficult to manage, and mana too as I never have to life tap with my current build, bar maybe Halazzi, but only done him once like I said earlier. I just DP whenever I have to move and it works wonders.

What's your thoughts on all this? Sorry if it's a little disjointed, but I have to get back to work now, lunch break is over. :P

Cheers.

Me: http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...assil&n=Kusasi
The destro lock: http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...&n=Becclescake

[shadowscream]

1st of all you should change a bit your dot rotation. Spells with long cast time such UA, Immolate, SB should be followed by instant cast spells. I would do it like this being the fact that you are SM/RUIN: Corr, Immolate, Curse of Agony, Siphon life, sb, sb...then reapply.

2nd thing is that is almost impossible to outdps on a SINGLE TARGET a destr warlock. And that is because SB has the best dps tho is more gear dependent.

Hope this helps! GL

[Solarus]

I would recommend you changing a few pieces of gear here and there exchanging hit for extra damage.

I would even go as far to say, you don't need all of that hit. Even going slightly under the hit rating if it helps you to balance the other aspects of your stats. You're a ruin build, you also need some more crit too. What good is having ruin when you won't crit? (as often)

Also, you have dots right? On packs that are being tanked by multiple tanks, take the time to put dots on all of them. Starting with the lowest priority mobs first so your dots have full time to tick.

[Theleb]

This has been covered before but as the usual comparison is UA vs Destro then I'll let this one slide for the purposes of education

a) She has +170 spell damage over you (and has gemmed for hit/damage rather than crit)
b) You should try to nail a rotation - it won't benefit you to the extent of closing an 300dps gap but if you say "sometimes" then you should definately change to that to "wherever possible".
c) Your +hit if excellent, your +crit/damage could do with some work.
d) You're just at the break point where 21/40 really starts to shine and as with a couple of other posters recently you need one or two drops before you can make the transition.
e) Couple of odd talent choices - Fel Concentration and Catclysm. Neither are really needed, and the latter is especially redundant in a build with Dark Pact.
f) T4 = Affliction was true for a long while because the crafted/BoJ rewards didn't exist to make Destruction viable at that gear level. Now, you can raid T4 as Destruction with aplomb if you take the time to gear correctly.

Have you considered something like:

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

The flexibility it gives you (CoE for Kiting, Malediction for raid-wide buf***e, Shadow Embrace synergy with soul siphon/SiLi for increased surviveability) combined with Ruin is very popular in many guilds where the gearing is such that a more traditional UA build with Malediction is lagging behind Mal/Ruin (hit capped, 20% crit or better, 1k-1.1k damage).

I played a very similar build for a while and my rotation was:

Amp. Curse > Trinket > CoD (Curse of Agony if the boss had less than a minute to live) > Corruption > Immo > SiLi > SB Spam until such time I had to re-apply DoTs. It will never break meters in the same way as 21/40 but I was the token affliction lock for Imp Buf***e and it still does respectable DPS.

Play around with your rotation - people have different personal favourite rotations so finding one that works is the key (some folks swear by a long cast, followed by an instant to take advantage of the GCD).

[Akasha]

Originally Posted by Kusasi

I believe all posts are moderated before being published, so if you're reading this, I guess it's ok. :P

No. Only threads posted under the 'Talent Builds: Help' section require approval before being published... which for the record, this post should probably be. *moved*

[Theleb]

*slaps self* yes, yes it should.

[Kusasi]

Thanks for your advises. I'm hoping I will soon have the T5 shoulders from Void Reaver, I'm about 4th in line on our priority list currently. Same deal with the dagger from Jan'alai too which I'll combine with the Orb of the Soul-Eater. I was looking at the changes that they would make on to me on Warcrafter.net but I'm not sure where to go with regards to gems. Should I stack damage up and not focus on crit as much? The reason I've balanced both is because I'm a DP/Ruin build and not UA. And would these 2 items tip me over into 0/21/40 becoming viable do you think? Any other items you think I should go for as well/instead?

I will definitely give that talent spec a try Theleb. Thanks for suggesting it. I put the 4 points in Cataclysm because I didn't really know where else to put them. I think I put the points in Fel Concentration due to the point constraints lower down the tree. Not sure how I didn't come across the spec you suggested.

I'll try that spell rotation too, particularly CoD instead of Curse of Agony. Is it worth using CoD instead of Curse of Agony every time or only when amp and/or trinket is available? I've read briefly the argument between each, on BeImba forums for example.

[Theleb]

CoD vs Curse of Agony is just something i prefer because its another spell/GCD I don't have to manage and with Ruin I felt that I should monopolise on SB spam time which did seem to increase my DPS/Raid DPS a fair amount. Curse of Agony will generally do more DPS in a direct comparison to CoD without factoring in the time gained by not having to recast Curse of Agony.

But.

If you have 4 or more Physical DPS then CoR increases their DPS beyond any contribution your CoD/Curse of Agony can make and the raid benefits more. Thats why I insist on CoR/CoE/CoS for my usual three-lock raid attendance, and only allow one to do Curse of Agony/CoD if the first three curses are covered.

If you pick up Wub's and then perhaps look at the Fetish of the Primal Gods (for the haste) or the Orb (for pure +damage) then I should imagine your hit will be way over cap allowing you to gem for +damage, your crit should be nearly where it needs to be (20% before Devastation) and your damage should increase a fair amount so yes, you should be fine for 21/40 (Note, do a little reading on the 21/40 build in the Den Forums and you'll find every single aspect of it analysed, including baseline viable stats).

Last thing, do take the time to DL Leulier's spreadsheet and you can play around with enchants/gems/items to your hearts content to see what represents the best DPS increase at any given time for you