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| Spells, Talents, Pets and DPS Discussion DoT's and Curses and Nukes, oh my! Discussion threads on everything relating to the Warlocks Spells, Talents, Pets and DPS. |
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April 18, 2009, 09:24 PM
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#1 (permalink) |
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53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
hello. i have been spending a LOT of time going through threads on different sites and testing out different specs (spent over 700 gold on just respeccing) and am now on a jam... i have been trying to compare the deep afflic build against the 40/31 build on raids.. i currently mainly raid naxx atm.. i was thinking since afflic "usually" shines on bosses over demo/destro that maybe dual spec it and just pop it up when on bosses? i havent been able to find anything talking about which is better for raid bosses.. my wowarmory is The World of Warcraft Armory i dont know if it would be better just sticking with my 40/31 build for everything? i have been averaging between 2500-2700 dps on overall in 10man naxx... 40/31 rotation -- Immo/Conflag/Curse of Agony(been looking at replacing Curse of Agony with CoE for the damage increase of fire)/Corr/Incin spam (i use conflag as much as i can and then do incin/soulfire spam when boss is under 25%) i keep my dots up and still hit conflag when its up as well as doing the incin/soulfire spam so i get the Decimation proc after each incin... i also use an imp in this spec 53/1/17 rotation -- SB/Haunt/Corr/UA/Curse of Agony/SB spam while keeping dots up. i also do DS when boss is under 25%. i use the succubus in this spec i have been trying everything to try to get my dps up in the top 5 on raids but it doesnt seem to want to move much.. any suggestions on what i can do to increase dps with my specs? the 40/31 is my main spec and i like that a lot better than 41/30 atm.. thank you  EDIT: i did some heroic dummie testing with just me hitting it (so wasnt messed up with other classes' debuffs) and the Afflic build was doing 100-200 more dps... 40/31 spec was doing about 2400 dps avg and when i was doing the soulfire/incin spam, my dps jumped about 50-100.. but when the 53/1/17 build, i was doin 2500-2600 dps steady as long as i kept my dots up.. i am still a little sloppy on the timing.. but i am keeping it as close as i can.. this is also heroic dummie without using my SP trinket.. i am also using the SpellStone for both specs.. i heard it is best for all-around builds.. is that true? or should i be using FireStone on my demo/destro build? Last edited by Sephent; April 18, 2009 at 10:40 PM.. |
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April 19, 2009, 05:38 AM
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#2 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Malaketh 80 Undead Warlock Dragonblight Euro PvE Guild: Dark Sun Profile: Blizzard Armory |
Re: 53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
In my opinion other spec for trash and other for bosses is a waste of money (1000g for dual spec wasted). Ofc trash has to be killed too to get to the bosses, but if your guild's raid leaders but more weight on overall dps than boss fights, something is wrong. I did a test run to hc Naxx yesterday with a pug just to see how I can perform in raids nowadays (I'm unguilded atm). We did plaque wing. I was 3rd on overall dps, but 1st on overall damage done (me 7,6%, 2nd 7,1% of damage). Also I was 1st in all of the 3 boss fights we did on dps and damage. I might be slightly better in overall if I took the trash seriously. And my spec is 53/1/17, rotation was Cow (other lock used coe), Sb, Haunt, Corr, Sb spam, refresh, from 25%onwards replace sb with DS. Soc on large trash groups. So I'm satisfied with my 3rd place on overall dps. It was a pug though and I'm going on a test run with one guild next week. I suppose I have to try to push myself a bit further then. Btw you should try to replace your head, neck and wand with some more warlocklike items. Mp5 isn't what we need and can be replaced by other stats. And when you run tests on dummy, you should cast few minutes (I run 5min tests) to get a better wiev of your overall dps. High peaks don't mean you end up high in the long run. Also test dummies are a problem for affl locks cause in real boss fight we use ds for the last 25% and it's very hard to find a full hp dummy. I've always thought it's in the end best to use the spec with which you feel most comfortable to play with. |
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April 19, 2009, 01:34 PM
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#3 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Hina 80 Human Warlock Asia PvE |
Re: 53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
Well for one thing, you should make it a habit to enchant all your gear. Your helm, shoulders, chest, wrists, feet have no enchants, and you're using the stamina spell thread for your legs, while the spirit version will give you some more spellpower. As for dual-specs, before 3.1 I also considered a boss-spec and a trash-spec. But now that 3.1 went live, I'm leaning towards a dummy-spec and a mobile-spec. Use the dummy spec for non-mobile fights like Patchwerk, and the mobile spec for movement fights. |
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April 19, 2009, 01:58 PM
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#4 (permalink) |
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Re: 53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
My dual spec is 53/1/17 for boss/instance fights and a 57/14/0 build for summoning soul wells or out questing/farming/PvP. Seems to work out well, I do just fine on trash mobs with a 53/1/17 build in Naxx and Ulduar. And I'm generally towards the top of the list in 10/25-man raids on boss damage. |
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April 19, 2009, 02:09 PM
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#5 (permalink) |
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Re: 53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
Yes. I have spent a bunch of gold as well respeccing, trying to find just the right build, as an old time affliction lock, I have tried many different Demon/destr builds, & am not happy at all. Training dummy DPS with what I have now is barely 2K.. which to me means I should be doing atleast 2.4K in 10 man or 5 man closer to that.. but i'm not I do much worse. I will re spec 1 last time b4 I go broke yet again. What I would like to see if someone post all hte DPS for all the specxs they try out. Thanx in advance. |
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April 19, 2009, 02:18 PM
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#6 (permalink) | |||
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Character Info
Tianshaan 80 Human Warlock Terokkar US PvE Guild: Vae Victus Profile: Blizzard Armory |
Re: 53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
Quote:
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Simply go here to the forums index, and there is a whole section entitled "DPS! ", and another one entitled "Spells & Talent Discussion". The Elitis Jerks thread with every spec listed in order of DPS viability right on the first page is here: Simulationcraft on post-3.1 specs - Elitist Jerks Quote:
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April 19, 2009, 02:25 PM
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#7 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Illeandrys 80 Blood Elf Warlock Frostmourne Oceania PvP Guild: Loot the Core Hound Profile: Blizzard Armory |
Re: 53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
I'm extremely happy that I switched from 53/0/18 pre-patch to 0/40/31. My DPS as Affliction dropped by ~500 from what I saw, after taking the spec out to test on dummies and in heroics. Speccing 0/40/31 bumped my DPS up by (literally) 1000. This is probably due to my gear being more suitable for a Destro build in the first place, with high crit and less haste. However, your results may vary. Here's what I see as the pros and cons of either build. Affliction: +High static fight DPS (Patchwerk), and extremely high execute DPS with Drain Soul. +Excellent self-healing. Really helps on healing-intensive fights. +Never run out of Soul Shards! (This is a problem for me doing progression raids in Ulduar) -Terrible trash DPS. We all know this. -Damage only kicks in after setting up multiple debuffs, which reinforces the problem with trash, and hurts on fights like Gothik and Archavon (haha), where raid-wide stuns can reset your rotation. -Horrible threat. Affliction has the highest threat of any spec due to DoTs attributing more threat per point of damage than direct damage spells, and this is compounded by the fact that you can't "just stop DPS". This was a massive problem for me, so much so that I enchanted Wisdom on my cloak and put a -2% threat gem in my helm. 0/40/31: +High overall DPS, and very high (not as high as Affliction) execute DPS. Execute range starts from 35% too. +Excellent trash DPS/burst damage. Rolling Decimation buffs mean you can nuke for about 4k DPS on big trash, and Rain of Fire is very strong with this spec. This means you will do very well on fights with a lot of adds or where you have to split DPS, like Gothik and Emalon. Ulduar seems to have a lot of bosses like this (Razorscale and Kologarn are prime examples) +Great for heroics, if you like to do those. +Great passive buffs. I have ~300 more spellpower as 0/40/31 compared to Affliction, plus the Spellstone buff is fantastic. -High frontloaded threat. Conflagrate can still crit for upwards of 10k post-nerf (highest I've seen was 21 or 24k yesterday in Ulduar with Lightweave procs and Wild Magic). You have to be careful on a lot of pulls. I generally Conflagrate only after the tank has used Thunderclap/Swipe/etc. -Poor Soul Shard management. You shouldn't be casting Drain Soul in raid. -Highly reliant on your Imp for the passive buffs and damage output. Your passive healing might not be enough if there is a lot of raid damage going around or you tend to just fire and forget with the Imp and there are things like void zones. -Your healers will be feeding your mana. It's not an issue for me but if they are undergeared it could pose a problem. For reference, I raid with about 2520 spellpower self-buffed (2420 when there is no SPriest/Moonkin). So far, I've only managed to run one H Naxx with an Affliction Warlock since the patch, so I don't think this is reliable, but I outdamaged her overall by 5 or 10% and she was much better geared. Then again, trash probably made up quite a bit of that and buffs were inconsistent. She did kick my *** on Patchwerk though. EDIT: My dual-spec is for PvP, so I don't have the luxury of testing running 2 raid specs at the same time. I wouldn't bother paying 1000g just to do well on trash, though. Last edited by jon__; April 19, 2009 at 02:38 PM.. |
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April 19, 2009, 02:39 PM
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#8 (permalink) |
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Re: 53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
here is a post that kind of gives you an idea of dps for diff specs.. but is not accurate.. Preview of possibly successful patch 3.1 raiding specs - The Warlocks Den Forums well i used to be deep demo with SiLi in afflic until about 78.. then i did full demo/destro.. i believe was a meta/sb build.. was nice but meta kept getting me killed or pulling aggro if there were multiple mobs when using immolation aura.. i really like the 40/31 spec setup.. im just tired of being just barely in the top 10 for overall dps in 25man raids.. i want people to see that i can be dependable dps.. and what enchants do you recommend? im poor so i never really looked into enchants.. im hoping my guild decides to finish our 10man naxx tonight and then ill check out the afflic build on bosses.. i definately need to get used to the rotations on it.. but i need a change sometimes from my everyday spec.. so maybe this will make things more interesting ill let you guys know how it goes if we do end up doing it tonight.. and i originally got the dual spec to help compare a couple specs i was looking at.. so id be raiding and use 1 spec on a boss and junk.. then switch to the other spec.. etc.. helped out. i dont pvp at all so i didnt care about having 1 pvp spec and the other pve.. im just trying to get the best out of my lock as i can in raids what do you recommend for a new head, wand, and neck? iv been trying to get my tier helm --- Information Added --- i did go to those sites.. those are all simucraft and not someone actually going and trying this out.. so i was trying to see if someone actually had some experience with trying to compare these two.. |
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April 19, 2009, 05:49 PM
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#9 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Icklespud 85 Gnome Warlock wildhammer Euro PvE Talent Tree: Affliction |
Re: 53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
at about 2250 spell damage without much buffing, I found 41/30 utterly underpowered. I will look again at 40/31 I think after this post, and also, when glyphs become available that full meta spec...might be fun. affliction beats 40/31 though hands down at my slighty poor gear (2*T7) level. |
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April 19, 2009, 05:59 PM
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#10 (permalink) |
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Character Info
Illeandrys 80 Blood Elf Warlock Frostmourne Oceania PvP Guild: Loot the Core Hound Profile: Blizzard Armory |
Re: 53/1/17 vs 0/40/31 on raid bosses
@Sephent EJ has really good coverage of enchants and gear and stuff like that. The Affliction thread has a (slightly outdated) list of gear to go for. Enchants are generally no-brainer, go for as much SP as you can while maintaining hit cap. I'd say your wand and helm are fine, for now. MP5 is a wasted stat, but they have good amounts of SP and base stats. Obviously the BiS items will be better, but not everyone is lucky with rolls. I noticed your hit rating is a little low on the Armory, unless you're running with a Shadow Priest/Moonkin + Suppression ALL the time (which you're not, if you're speccing hybrid). I'd try getting seperate sets for full hit cap, hit cap with Misery/Eclipse, and Supression + Misery/Eclipse, although that can be hard. Right now I go with exactly 446 hit rating as 0/40/31 requires hit cap from gear and switch out one or two pieces for more DPS stats when I have 3% from raid. I logged out in my PvE gear/spec so you can see what I'm wearing if you need any pointing in the right direction. Armory isn't reflecting my Master Demonologist and Demonic Knowledge buffs in my spellpower. EDIT: I should point out that I don't have the Life Tap glyph, since the person on my server to get it first decided to be ridiculous and set the price at 500g. You should get it. Last edited by jon__; April 19, 2009 at 06:04 PM.. |
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| 0/40/31, 53/1/17, Bosses, Raid |
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